Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1758066Ab3FEWiy (ORCPT ); Wed, 5 Jun 2013 18:38:54 -0400 Received: from mail-ie0-f176.google.com ([209.85.223.176]:43199 "EHLO mail-ie0-f176.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1757840Ab3FEWix (ORCPT ); Wed, 5 Jun 2013 18:38:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19865137.ey1FePPnmD@flatron> References: <19865137.ey1FePPnmD@flatron> Date: Wed, 5 Jun 2013 23:38:52 +0100 X-Google-Sender-Auth: ehxyqcOWzsrrY6JloZmw_Ww3mrM Message-ID: Subject: Re: getting allwinner SoC support upstream (was Re: Uploading linux (3.9.4-1)) From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton To: Tomasz Figa Cc: linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, "jonsmirl@gmail.com" , devicetree-discuss , Linux Kernel Mailing List , debian-arm@lists.debian.org, Linux on small ARM machines , debian-kernel@lists.debian.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 3157 Lines: 72 On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 10:52 PM, Tomasz Figa wrote: > Hi Luke, allo tomasz :) ok - much of what you say is duplicated by what russell said, so in effect the same reply is relevant, but there's been some cross-over. i'll summarise below and cut all but the key question below: > I tend to disagree with your view. Is it really our task to convince such > companies to work with open source community? their sheer overwhelming success provides us with mass-volume ultra-low cost hardware. to not make an effort to accommodate them would in this specific instance be a huge missed opportunity, responsibility for which currently falls on the shoulders of the sunxi community, where that small community is in no way considered "authoritative" as an upstream source and thus every single GNU/Linux Distro is left in a position of forcing people to follow insane non-standard build procedures that are *way* outside of the capability of the average person. so by the linux kernel developers intransigent position, the reach of free software as a whole is greatly reduced. simple logical unavoidable conclusion. please feel free - linux kernel developers - to maintain this intransigent position for as long as you find it useful to you to do so. btw, that is a sincere statement, devoid and completely free of all and any implicit or explicit additional statements and implications. >> > Device tree on ARM's goal is to achieve a single kernel across >> > vendors, not just a single kernel for a single vendor. >> >> you'll be aware that i've mentioned a number of times and have >> discussed at some length why this is a goal that is completely >> impossible to achieve [*1]. sadly. > > I tend to disagree on this as well, but it's another story. Have read one > of the discussions on this topic and it seemed to look more like lobbying > for one of the standards being promoted by some company, yeahh, that's rather unfortunate. i went to some lengths to avoid mentioning eoma [*1] until there was a natural point at which it became difficult *not* to bring it up, not least because i didn't hear anyone else presenting any actual real workable solutions. but, you have to bear in mind a couple of things: a) i'm a free software developer and advocate. "business", "lobbying" etc. do not come naturally to me. my associates scream at me regularly. b) i've been thinking about this incredibly hard problem for at least 4 years and almost *all* of my background in computing of the past 30 years leads me naturally towards actually coming up with a solution c) i'm actually really, really really and truly going about *actively* implementing that solution rather than just complaining about it *and* i'm inviting free software developers to participate, why, because see first sentence of a) above. l. [*1] which is an open standard, not a proprietary locked one. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/