Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2013 12:54:56 +0200
From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org>
To: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
Cc: Sarah Sharp <sarah.a.sharp@linux.intel.com>, CAI Qian <caiqian@redhat.com>,
        David Lang <david@lang.hm>,
        ksummit-2013-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org,
        Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
        Darren Hart <dvhart@linux.intel.com>,
        Olivier Galibert <galibert@pobox.com>, stable <stable@vger.kernel.org>,
        Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
        Willy Tarreau <w@1wt.eu>,
        Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-2013-discuss] [ATTEND] How to act on LKML
Message-ID: <20130719105456.GC26716@gmail.com>
References: <20130716224357.GK4994@xanatos>
 <1374015299.6458.76.camel@gandalf.local.home>
 <20130716231217.GL4994@xanatos>
 <51E5D7C8.5000306@gmail.com>
 <1374018809.2249.29.camel@leira.trondhjem.org>
 <1000066089.1803398.1374046596236.JavaMail.root@redhat.com>
 <20130717144849.GB16513@xanatos>
 <1374073771.6458.143.camel@gandalf.local.home>
 <20130717185138.GC17906@xanatos>
 <1374089368.6458.191.camel@gandalf.local.home>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <1374089368.6458.191.camel@gandalf.local.home>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15)
Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org
Content-Length: 3719
Lines: 87


* Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 2013-07-17 at 11:51 -0700, Sarah Sharp wrote:
> 
> > > I have to ask. How much verbal abuse have you received in LKML? And I
> > > don't mean in this thread.
> > 
> > I assume you also want me to exclude the verbal abuse and personal
> > threats I've received via email and my blog because of this thread.
> > But, just for reference, I'll post them here as well.
> 
> That's the nastiness of the Internet, a different topic than LKML
> development. And I don't consider this thread really a LKML thread, as
> it's about social behavior and nothing about the Linux kernel itself.
> 
> > 
> > Here's a gem from a senior software developer at Nvidia:
> > https://picasaweb.google.com/116960357493251979546/Trolls#5901298464591248626
> > 
> > And another email from a software developer in Portland, where I live:
> > https://picasaweb.google.com/116960357493251979546/Trolls#5901288095984358098
> 
> Both are cowardly trolls that didn't post publicly.
> 
> > 
> > On my blog, here's some choice comments, mostly asking me to quit kernel
> > development, along with more than a few misogynist comments:
> > 
> > "You volunteered to help out on the Linux journey. He never volunteered
> > to care for your feelings, nor did anyone else. It???s an opt-in community
> > and you can always opt out at any time. Caveat emptor."
> > 
> > "You???re no one compared to Linus. Start being Alan Cox or Theodore T???so
> > first to criticize him for his behaviour."
> > 
> > "Drama Queen"
> > 
> > "The LKML is not a place for easily offended girls to be. Get over
> > yourself."
> > 
> > "shit, just what we need ??? a bitch running around crying about how hurt
> > her feelings are."
> > 
> > "Oy vey you poor goyi???girl. You need to teach these sexist boys that
> > being racist is wrong. Think of the wonderful things that womyn have
> > done in the IT field. Clearly Linus is a rape apologist who fosters
> > negative views of minorities."
> > 
> > "This is why women are viewed as pathetic jokes, especially in the tech
> > world ??? because you???re weak and ineffectual, insufferable pansies who
> > expect the world to cater and accommodate your thin skin and easily
> > offended hyper-sensibilities. Grow the fuck up bitch. It???s real cute how
> > you???ve tried to paint yourself as some gallant Joan of Arc, crusading
> > against ???muh bigotry??? and ???muh intolerance.??? You???re a feminist joke, one
> > in a very long line."
> 
> Again, this is the Internet social media, which is not an environment 
> for productivity, but a cesspool of filth. Off topic to what I asked.
> 
> > Speaking out about this has made the crazies come out of the woodwork.
> 
> And what did you expect? The Internet if filled with assholes.

It's worse than that: being an asshole appears to also be correlated with 
the likelihood of speaking up on forums! So assholes are overrepresented, 
especially on forums that are semi-anonymous.

Sarah, you should see some of the hateful comments I got over past 
scheduler maintenance decisions... [Or rather, you should not.]

When being involved in polarizing discussions, especially if you yourself 
frame it as polarizing, you should expect to receive a wide spectrum of 
opinion and outright trolling.

The hateful, despicable, abhorrent trolling you cited should not be 
projected over to your opponent in the discussion, unless your opponent 
voices it as well ...

Thanks,

	Ingo
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/