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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 12:30:57 -0500 (EST)
From: Alexander Viro <viro@math.psu.edu>
To: Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net>
cc: Stephen Wille Padnos <stephen.willepadnos@verizon.net>,
       Dax Kelson <dax@gurulabs.com>, Chris Wedgwood <cw@f00f.org>,
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       Linus Torvalds <torvalds@transmeta.com>,
       Rusty Russell <rusty@rustcorp.com.au>, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: What's left over.
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On Thu, 31 Oct 2002, Stephen Frost wrote:

> So you're not really arguing against ACLs, you're complaining that
> userspace is broken when there's shared write access.  That's fine,
> userspace should be fixed, inclusion of ACLs into the kernel shouldn't
> be denied because of this.  ACLs should be optional, of course, and if
> you want them some really noisy warnings about the problems of shared
> writeable area with current userspace tools.  Of course, that same
> warning should probably be included in 'groupadd'.

	No.  I'm saying that ACLs do not have a point until at least basic
userland gets ready for setups people want ACLs for.  Adding features that
can't be used until $BIG_WORK is done is idiocy in the best case and
danger in the worst.  Especially since $BIG_WORK does not depend on these
features.

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