Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1760744AbbBIKx5 (ORCPT ); Mon, 9 Feb 2015 05:53:57 -0500 Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:34486 "EHLO out1-smtp.messagingengine.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1760195AbbBIKxz (ORCPT ); Mon, 9 Feb 2015 05:53:55 -0500 X-Sasl-enc: wRHrIofPnb3mKlf4fOlNhS/E+ZE7uPRqN0vFw8WB+CkB 1423479234 Message-ID: <54D891C0.2010303@imap.cc> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2015 11:53:52 +0100 From: Tilman Schmidt User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bas Peters , Karsten Keil CC: Paul Bolle , Joe Perches , Sergei Shtylyov , "isdn@linux-pingi.de" , Julia Lawall , David Miller , netdev@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: Kill I4L? References: <1423328797-17865-1-git-send-email-baspeters93@gmail.com> <1423328797-17865-3-git-send-email-baspeters93@gmail.com> <54D650BF.5000400@cogentembedded.com> <1423336761.2933.7.camel@perches.com> <1423341800.2246.68.camel@x220> <54D7BD4A.4090101@imap.cc> <54D7F87E.4050506@linux-pingi.de> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 3180 Lines: 73 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am 09.02.2015 um 11:07 schrieb Bas Peters: > 2015-02-09 0:59 GMT+01:00 Karsten Keil : >> Am 08.02.2015 um 20:47 schrieb Tilman Schmidt: >>> Am 07.02.2015 um 21:43 schrieb Paul Bolle: >>>> [M]aybe we should consider, say, removing i4l and pre i4l and >>>> see who complains. That might be a rude thing to do. So >>>> perhaps the various ISDN flavors should be left alone until >>>> ... what exactly? >>> >>> I'd support that step. I don't think it'll hurt anyone because >>> the cards supported by i4l are mostly ISA cards anyway. The >>> only exceptions are the HiSax family which is now supported by >>> mISDN, and the Hypercope family which is supported by CAPI. [...] >> >> But I4L is still the default in some Distros, so we should allow >> a warning period. But again, I'm fine with this to do it. > > Is there any explicit reason why 'dead' drivers that might still > have some users ought to be removed? The reason is the maintenance load it produces. There's a continuous, annoying trickle of patch proposals, discussions, conflicts with development in other, still actively maintained areas of the kernel, and so on. The present discussion being a point in case. > Does it hurt anyone to leave the code in there, despite it barely > being used? Yes it does. Not much, but the pain is increasing over the years. Every time someone tries to touch that code there's the problem that no one can actually answer for it, much less test anything. Theoretically a patch for a driver should not be accepted without testing it on the actual hardware, but in the isdn tree that rule has long been abandoned because nobody has the hardware and can do the test. Consequently it isn't even clear whether all of it still actually works. It also hurts the few remaining Linux ISDN developers, distros and users that Linux ISDN support is so fragmented. For example, the Gigaset ISDN driver which I maintain can be built with either CAPI or I4L support, so each time I touch it I have to build and test two variants. > We're not talking about a particularly huge driver here, either. But one that's particularly difficult to maintain, without providing any noticeable benefit in return. - -- Tilman Schmidt E-Mail: tilman@imap.cc Bonn, Germany Diese Nachricht besteht zu 100% aus wiederverwerteten Bits. Ungeöffnet mindestens haltbar bis: (siehe Rückseite) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJU2JHAAAoJEFPuqx0v+F+qn5EH/0iXrzTWChbu/0W8nDz4/qtC FWQYbeIxTutzsEtVAhOYM7mz+9mqgaqNkVpmrz4lLg3FY4q2kzG1GjSihqP0GsT+ rLWJ+7gTnNxjNOk6OOZo+GaOjcvtVAro/2N5NXhHxTseumbH4I371a2rw0HBls97 iCPB2g6mJvNnsLjb612qcgsGahxMWVE/3q+6O1IKujPCTNQsJNaeqQMPT3YFJwq+ 4YMs55RpVbpP5GPdRsaW/Zkwx8Se/4cK1MFaqX9xEePgZDUYMCPT2BPEa7E3yUwF kjJU5LnBTKAjI8IzXDPTzznAyrMnH6IAjtJSmwpnyNintv2dtCK0VPhjhh0TA/M= =d5Or -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/