Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S932173AbbHFIZZ (ORCPT ); Thu, 6 Aug 2015 04:25:25 -0400 Received: from mondschein.lichtvoll.de ([194.150.191.11]:49105 "EHLO mail.lichtvoll.de" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1755110AbbHFIZU convert rfc822-to-8bit (ORCPT ); Thu, 6 Aug 2015 04:25:20 -0400 From: Martin Steigerwald To: David Herrmann Cc: Andy Lutomirski , Linus Torvalds , Andy Lutomirski , "linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" , Djalal Harouni , Greg KH , Havoc Pennington , "Eric W. Biederman" , One Thousand Gnomes , Tom Gundersen , Daniel Mack , "Kalle A. Sandstrom" , Borislav Petkov , cee1 Subject: Re: kdbus: to merge or not to merge? Date: Thu, 06 Aug 2015 10:25:18 +0200 Message-ID: <10354482.MDn72IWdzQ@merkaba> User-Agent: KMail/4.14.5 (Linux/4.2.0-rc5-tp520-btrfstrim+; KDE/4.14.2; x86_64; ; ) In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 1560 Lines: 35 Am Donnerstag, 6. August 2015, 10:04:57 schrieb David Herrmann: > > Given that all existing prototype userspace that I'm aware of > > > > (systemd and its consumers) apparently opts in, I don't really care > > that the feature is opt-in. > > This is just plain wrong. Out of the dozens of dbus applications, you > found like 9 which are buggy? Two of them are already fixed, the > maintainers of the other ones notified. > I'd be interested where you got this notion that "all existing > prototype userspace [...] opts in". But these few can create the issues Andy described? Sure, one can argue I can setup a stress or stress-ng command line invocation as root user that will basically grind a Linux system to a halt – and in a way I consider this to be a bug in the kernel as well, but one that exists since a long time. But a GUI application running as a user? How about some robustness regarding what you see as bugs in userspace here? I think "The bug is not mine" is exactly the same language we have seen here before. If the kernel relies on bug-free userspace applications in order to do its job properly I think it has robustness issues. One certainly wouldn´t want this with any mission critical realtime OS. I think it is the kernel that should be in control. Thanks, -- Martin -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/