Subject: Re: Driver Model 2 Proposal - Linux Kernel Performance v Usability
From: Martin Schlemmer <azarah@gentoo.org>
To: jimwclark@ntlworld.com
Cc: Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu, LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
In-Reply-To: <200309051931.09491.jimwclark@ntlworld.com>
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	 <200309051752.h85HqYS0031240@turing-police.cc.vt.edu>
	 <200309051931.09491.jimwclark@ntlworld.com>
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Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 20:59:33 +0200
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On Fri, 2003-09-05 at 20:31, James Clark wrote:
> Valdis Kletnieks wrote:
> 
> > So if 500 million people are productive 60% of the time and hosed 40% of
> > the time, and 5 million people are productive 95% of the time, the 60/40
> > model is better because 60% of 500M is more than 95% of 5M?
> 
> This is a good example of the kind of rubbish that is sometimes talked around 
> here. I've lost count of the number of times I've heard the 'Windows is SO 
> unstable argument' it almost seems like a religion. I would agree with what 
> you have said if Windows was actually unusable 40% of the time. Do you really 
> believe this figure? In reality it is much better than that as plainly the 
> majority of the WORLD are using it. I love Linux but I also use Windows. 
> Sorry to break your delusion, it ain't that bad.
> 
> > Ask Joe User how he feels about NOT being able to add IPv6 support to
> > his existing system until his vendor says they'll do it for him, and then
> > look at when Linux had support.
> 
> Its very true that in the Windows world you have to wait for Micro$oft 
> sometimes, it is even true that they probably hold back features so that can 
> put them in the next release and get you to pay for them. Why is this any 
> worse than expecting Joe User, who is a 'user' and not a 'developer' to 
> rebuild the most important bits of his OS and risk breaking the whole lot.
> 
> This is not about Windows v Linux so please stop compraring what I have 
> proposed to Windows. This debate should be about Performance v Usability. 
> Source interfaces have ultimate performance, nobody has suggested, yet, that 
> they are easier for Joe User than a binary interface.
> 

Right.  Not trying to get involved in this mess [8)], but there
was a few other comments that was less linux/windows, but more
valid ... what about responding to them?  Could be interesting
to hear what you have to say ...


> James
> 
> 
> 
> On Friday 05 Sep 2003 6:52 pm, you wrote:
> > On Thu, 04 Sep 2003 22:51:38 BST, James Clark said:
> > > FUD. It mostly works, sometimes it doesn't, but in total the number of
> > > working hours of PRODUCTIVE use from it is many orders of magnitude
> > > greater. Multiple the number of Windows users in the world by their
> > > working time and then do the same for Linux!
> >
> > So if 500 million people are productive 60% of the time and hosed 40% of
> > the time, and 5 million people are productive 95% of the time, the 60/40
> > model is better because 60% of 500M is more than 95% of 5M?
> >
> > What's wrong with this picture?
> >
> > > hence the OS could escape the niche box it currently is in. Please ask
> > > Joe User how he feels about rebuilding his whole OS to add IP6 support to
> > > an existing stable system etc.
> >
> > Ask Joe User how he feels about NOT being able to add IPv6 support to
> > his existing system until his vendor says they'll do it for him, and then
> > look at when Linux had support.
> >
> > http://www.ipv6.org/impl/linux.html
> > http://www.ipv6.org/impl/windows.html
> >
> > And most important, google around for +ipv6 +"craig metz", and look at when
> > *he* did the IPv6 work - and you were free to put the patches on your
> > system as soon as he posted them.
> >
> > Now as you were saying?
> 
> -
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Martin Schlemmer


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