Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S262054AbUJ3CmU (ORCPT ); Fri, 29 Oct 2004 22:42:20 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S262614AbUJ3CmU (ORCPT ); Fri, 29 Oct 2004 22:42:20 -0400 Received: from ipcop.bitmover.com ([192.132.92.15]:32437 "EHLO work.bitmover.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S262054AbUJ3CkG (ORCPT ); Fri, 29 Oct 2004 22:40:06 -0400 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 19:39:14 -0700 From: Larry McVoy To: Ram?n Rey Vicente , Scott Lockwood , Larry McVoy , Xavier Bestel , James Bruce , Linus Torvalds , Roman Zippel , Andrea Arcangeli , Linux Kernel Subject: Re: BK kernel workflow Message-ID: <20041030023914.GB419@work.bitmover.com> Mail-Followup-To: Larry McVoy , Ram?n Rey Vicente , Scott Lockwood , Larry McVoy , Xavier Bestel , James Bruce , Linus Torvalds , Roman Zippel , Andrea Arcangeli , Linux Kernel References: <4180B9E9.3070801@andrew.cmu.edu> <20041028135348.GA18099@work.bitmover.com> <1098972379.3109.24.camel@gonzales> <20041028151004.GA3934@work.bitmover.com> <41827B89.4070809@hispalinux.es> <20041029173642.GA5318@work.bitmover.com> <41828707.3050803@hispalinux.es> <57875.65.208.227.246.1099074830.squirrel@www.lrsehosting.com> <4182923D.5040500@hispalinux.es> <20041029193924.GA10216@work.bitmover.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20041029193924.GA10216@work.bitmover.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org From: Roman Zippel (zippel@linux-m68k.org) > What someone does in the privacy of his home is outside the scope of the > GPL, this means the kernel repository is the private toy of Linus and he > leaves the decision who may play with him to Larry. Anyone who thinks this is incorrect. Yes, I have a lot of influence on the license under which BK is shipped, I own more than 50% of the stock in BitMover. On the other hand, I have a board of directors, we call board meetings for any serious decision and I have never overridden the board. Not once. And it is extremely unlikely that I ever will, the whole point of the board (at least in our company) is to have a sounding board where we make sure we aren't doing something stupid. There are calmer heads than mine prevailing and there isn't any way that Roman & Co are going to piss me off enough that we will do something stupid. There is zero chance of that. We've set up process to make sure that doesn't happen. > This is also means that Linux history recorded in bk is not part of the > public record. It is indeed part of the public record, Linus has it and so do about 10,000 other people. Let's look at that, shall we? Suppose I lost what little mind I have left and said, against the advice our board, I'm sick of whiners like Roman, let's shut them down and revoke the BK license. Never mind the fact that I can't do that, any court in the world would spank us hard for trying to do it, let's just suppose. So there you are with a pile of bits on disk. Are you really suggesting, Roman, that the collective intelligence of the free software world is so pathetic that they can't extract the information they want from those bits? Remember, you already have the nightly BK2CVS snapshots on master.kernel.org and we can't retract those even if we tried. You have that and the bits on disk and your brain. And you can't get what you want? How lame is that? Are you really saying, in public, that you can't handle that? I know you are smarter than that, I've read your code. > This is an unfortunate fact and not a complaint BTW, but > Larry has not much use for facts anyway, when I try to summarize the facts > around the publicly available information as best as I can, Larry doesn't > even try to prove me wrong and instead continues to attack me personally. > I don't really care about the latter, but that he gets the support to do > so is the personally very disappointing part. :-( Roman, I'm not attacking you. I think your view on things leaves something to be desired but I think that if BK wasn't in the picture we would agree on 90% of the problems we faced together. If you think I'm attacking you then you are not listening. I've been trying to tell you that we are trying to help and you keep not listening. Whatever. But suggesting that I'm attacking you is just nonsense. I don't care about you enough to bother attacking you, that's one thing, and I abhor the concept of attacking a person regardless of their beliefs, that's the other thing. If someone attacked you, Roman, as a person, I'd defend you. That's an awful thing to do and it is unacceptable. On the other hand, I am attacking your position on this one issue. I think you don't understand how hard it has been to build the technology to help you and I think you have no idea what it takes to create a business model which supports that effort. That's an attack, I admit it, on your thoughts on this issue. I respect you as a person and as a contributor to the Linux kernel but I do not agree with your views on this one issue. Anyone who has been to graduate school or has learned this lesson elsewhere knows the difference between an attack on what you said and an attack on you as a person. There's a big difference. -- --- Larry McVoy lm at bitmover.com http://www.bitkeeper.com - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/