Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 15:04:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andre Hedrick <andre@linux-ide.org>
To: Luben Tuikov <luben_tuikov@adaptec.com>
cc: "David S. Miller" <davem@davemloft.net>, jgarzik@pobox.com,
       willy@w.ods.org, patmans@us.ibm.com, ltuikov@yahoo.com,
       linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, akpm@osdl.org, torvalds@osdl.org,
       linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org,
       James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@steeleye.com>
Subject: Re: I request inclusion of SAS Transport Layer and AIC-94xx into
 the kernel
In-Reply-To: <433D8542.1010601@adaptec.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.10.10509301305070.27623-100000@master.linux-ide.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org
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On Fri, 30 Sep 2005, Luben Tuikov wrote:

> Hi Andre,
> 
> Let me know if this 4 section write up satisfies:

> Section 4: Politics
> -------------------
> 
> Let's face it: SAS is a new emerging technology.
> It will be the technology for the next 10-15 years,
> and *everybody* in Linux SCSI wants a piece of it.
> Everybody wants their name and contribution to it.

No true, many of us could careless about credit list.

> This is fine, but we need people who clearly understand
> the technology and clearly understand what, how
> and why it works.  We need well-read and well educated
> people.  Linux dedication is fine, but protocol knowlege
> is needed too.

Sometimes teaching others is a better way to bring them around to your
view point while learning about their goals.  Since everyone/most agree
your T10 knowledge is strong, others have pointed out you are savy enough
to work around problems over fixing them in general.  Blah blah ...

Just show everyone why it can not work the "Linux Way" and defend the
points logically.  Should the defense of it not be possible, then the
point is lost.

> Can Linux afford people who have never even read SAS
> to write SAS Code for Linux.  Yes, sure.  It is the
> Linux's ideology: "specs are cr@p".

SPECs become crap when organizations like STA with T10 make joining and
voting on the technology under NCITS $10,000.00 annual membership.  This
is old boys club rules, otherwise I would have joined and terrorized T10
like I did to T13.  Exclusion breeds distrust.

> Conclusion
> ----------
> 
> Even though the SAS Transport Layer follows an _already_
> establised layering infrastructure for more (less?) exotic
> transports such as USB and SBP, James Bottomley has resisted
> its inclusion in Linux SCSI.

If this is accurate then it is fair to raise a question; however, few can
stand in judgement because they were present in for the discussions.  The
remander (self included) are in the dark.

Cheers,

Andre

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