Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S964977AbVKVQPB (ORCPT ); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:15:01 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S964976AbVKVQPB (ORCPT ); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:15:01 -0500 Received: from fw5.argo.co.il ([194.90.79.130]:24593 "EHLO argo2k.argo.co.il") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S964975AbVKVQPA (ORCPT ); Tue, 22 Nov 2005 11:15:00 -0500 Message-ID: <43834400.3040506@argo.co.il> Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 18:14:56 +0200 From: Avi Kivity User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7-1.1.fc4 (X11/20050929) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeff Garzik CC: Jon Smirl , Benjamin Herrenschmidt , Alan Cox , Dave Airlie , Greg KH , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: [RFC] Small PCI core patch References: <20051121225303.GA19212@kroah.com> <20051121230136.GB19212@kroah.com> <1132616132.26560.62.camel@gaston> <21d7e9970511211647r4df761a2l287715368bf89eb6@mail.gmail.com> <1132623268.20233.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1132626478.26560.104.camel@gaston> <9e4733910511211923r69cdb835pf272ac745ae24ed7@mail.gmail.com> <43833D61.9050400@argo.co.il> <20051122155143.GA30880@havoc.gtf.org> In-Reply-To: <20051122155143.GA30880@havoc.gtf.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Nov 2005 16:14:58.0828 (UTC) FILETIME=[E26804C0:01C5EF7F] Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 1210 Lines: 37 Jeff Garzik wrote: >On Tue, Nov 22, 2005 at 05:46:41PM +0200, Avi Kivity wrote: > > >>4) Write a translation layer (for xorg or the kernel) that can load >>Windows drivers. Use binary translation for non-x86. Hope the APIs are >>not patented. >> >> > >Give up all hope of ever diagnosing or fixing a crash. > >Welcome to Windows instability, circa 1995. > > > You exaggerate. Windows drivers work well enough in Windows (or so I presume). One just has to implement the environment these drivers expect, very carefully. For the untrusting, options do remain: - run the driver in userspace (if it's a xorg driver, in a separate process) so that all outputs can be validated - use binary translation even on x86 and validate all memory and I/O accesses (like valgrind, but hopefully faster) It's still possible for the driver to dma stuff where it shouldn't. Maybe IOMMU games (where available) can help. But I seriously doubt it will be that bad. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/