Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1750790AbWBVPqT (ORCPT ); Wed, 22 Feb 2006 10:46:19 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1751341AbWBVPqT (ORCPT ); Wed, 22 Feb 2006 10:46:19 -0500 Received: from smtp.osdl.org ([65.172.181.4]:29861 "EHLO smtp.osdl.org") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1750790AbWBVPqT (ORCPT ); Wed, 22 Feb 2006 10:46:19 -0500 Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2006 07:44:16 -0800 (PST) From: Linus Torvalds To: Kay Sievers cc: Pekka J Enberg , Greg KH , Adrian Bunk , Robert Love , Andrew Morton , Linux Kernel Mailing List , John Stultz Subject: Re: 2.6.16-rc4: known regressions In-Reply-To: <20060222152743.GA22281@vrfy.org> Message-ID: References: <20060217231444.GM4422@stusta.de> <84144f020602190306o3149d51by82b8ccc6108af012@mail.gmail.com> <20060219145442.GA4971@stusta.de> <1140383653.11403.8.camel@localhost> <20060220010205.GB22738@suse.de> <1140562261.11278.6.camel@localhost> <20060221225718.GA12480@vrfy.org> <20060222152743.GA22281@vrfy.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 1762 Lines: 45 On Wed, 22 Feb 2006, Kay Sievers wrote: > > Well, that's part of the contract by using an experimental version of HAL, > it has nothing to do with the kernel NO NO NO! Dammit, if this is the logic and mode of operation of HAL people, then we must stop accepting patches to the kernel from HAL people. THIS IS NOT DEBATABLE. If you cannot maintain a stable kernel interface, then you damn well should not send your patches in for inclusion in the standard kernel. Keep your own "HAL-unstable" kernel and ask people to test it there. It really is that easy. Once a system call or other kernel interface goes into the standard kernel, it stays that way. It doesn't get switched around to break user space. Bugs happen, and sometimes we break user space by mistake. Sometimes it really really is inevitable. But we NEVER EVER say what you say: "it's your own fault". It's _our_ fault, and it's _our_ problem to work out. Guys: you now have two choices: fix it by sending me a patch and an explanation of what went wrong, or see the patch that broke things be reverted. And STOP THIS DAMN APOLOGIA. I'm fed up with hearing how "breaking user space is ok because it's HAL or hotplug". IT IS NOT OK. Get your damn act together, and stop blaming other people. If the interfaces were bad, we keep them around. Look in fs/stat.c some day. Realize that some of those interfaces are from 1991. They were bad, but that doesn't change _anything_. People used them, and we had implemented them. Linus - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/