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In-Reply-To: <20211218225211.epa4u6mtjnvgkw4x@box.shutemov.name>
From:   Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Date:   Sat, 18 Dec 2021 15:05:55 -0800
Message-ID: <CAHk-=whJWmj70d6yCzYPvrC-6V-6jwkJ4mrVc_p3toy4Lz_nhg@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v1 06/11] mm: support GUP-triggered unsharing via
 FAULT_FLAG_UNSHARE (!hugetlb)
To:     "Kirill A. Shutemov" <kirill@shutemov.name>
Cc:     David Hildenbrand <david@redhat.com>,
        Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
        Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
        Hugh Dickins <hughd@google.com>,
        David Rientjes <rientjes@google.com>,
        Shakeel Butt <shakeelb@google.com>,
        John Hubbard <jhubbard@nvidia.com>,
        Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@nvidia.com>,
        Mike Kravetz <mike.kravetz@oracle.com>,
        Mike Rapoport <rppt@linux.ibm.com>,
        Yang Shi <shy828301@gmail.com>,
        "Kirill A . Shutemov" <kirill.shutemov@linux.intel.com>,
        Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
        Vlastimil Babka <vbabka@suse.cz>, Jann Horn <jannh@google.com>,
        Michal Hocko <mhocko@kernel.org>,
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        Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com>,
        Peter Xu <peterx@redhat.com>,
        Donald Dutile <ddutile@redhat.com>,
        Christoph Hellwig <hch@lst.de>,
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On Sat, Dec 18, 2021 at 2:52 PM Kirill A. Shutemov <kirill@shutemov.name> wrote:
>
> So you are saying that if a GUP user wants to see changes made by
> userspace to the page after the GUP it must ask for FOLL_WRITE, even if it
> doesn't have intend to write to the page?

Yup. Put the onus very clearly on GUP.

It's a very special operation, and it's one of the operations that
cause a lot of problems for the VM code. It's by no means the _only_
one - we've got a lot of other things that cause issues - but I think
it's very clear that GUP is very very special, and nobody should say
"I want GUP to do whatever".

There are two cases for GUP:

 - look up the page as it is *NOW*

 - look up the page in order to see any future state on it (and
possibly modify it)

that "any future state" is a fundamentally much heavier operation.
It's the one that really *has* to get rid of any sharing, and it has
to make sure no sharing happens in the future either.

So ii it is an anonymous page, it basically needs to act like a write.
Even if that page is then used only for reading.

Note that here that "if it's anonymous" is kind of a big deal. If it's
a shared file-mapped page, at that point it's "just another
reference". It's potentially problematic even in that case (think of
"truncate()" that tries to force-unmap all pages from VM's), but for
the shared case the answer is "if you truncate it and disassociate the
page from the mapping, it's _your_ problem.

And once it acts as a write, and once it does that COW and we have
exclusive access to it, it might as well be just writable and dirty.
You've done the expensive part already. You've forced it to be private
to that VM.

And this was all triggered by the user doing something very special,
so no amount of "but POSIX" or whatever matters.

GUP is not great. If you use GUP, you get to deal with the downsides.

               Linus