Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S964777AbXBYUQA (ORCPT ); Sun, 25 Feb 2007 15:16:00 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S933700AbXBYUQA (ORCPT ); Sun, 25 Feb 2007 15:16:00 -0500 Received: from keil-draco.com ([216.193.185.50]:50367 "EHLO mail" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-FAIL) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S932995AbXBYUPx (ORCPT ); Sun, 25 Feb 2007 15:15:53 -0500 From: "D. Hazelton" To: "Michael K. Edwards" Subject: Re: GPL vs non-GPL device drivers Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 15:15:22 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 Cc: "Pavel Machek" , davids@webmaster.com, "v j" , trent.waddington@gmail.com, "Linux-Kernel@Vger. Kernel. Org" , "Neil Brown" References: <3d57814d0702191458l1021caeyaefd7775398c5f2a@mail.gmail.com> <20070225104211.GB2045@elf.ucw.cz> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200702251515.22703.dhazelton@enter.net> Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 3072 Lines: 53 On Sunday 25 February 2007 06:54, Michael K. Edwards wrote: > On 2/25/07, Pavel Machek wrote: > But a 20KLoC 3-D graphics driver that happens to #include > is not thereby a "derivative work" of the kernel, > no matter how many entrypoints are labeled EXPORT_SYMBOL_GPL or > provided as inline functions. And under the Lexmark standard, > MODULE_LICENSE("GPL") with a disclaimer in the doco is by far the > sanest way to deal with the EXPORT_SYMBOL_GPL mind games, and likely > (IANAL, TINLA) to be endorsed by any court in the US and probably lots > of other places too. Especially when the graphics chip maker explains > that keeping their driver source code closed isn't really an attempt > to hide their knowledge under a bushel basket. It's a defensive > measure against having their retail margins destroyed by nitwits who > take out all the busy-wait loops and recompile with -O9 to get another > tenth of a frame per second, and then pretend ignorance when > attempting to return their slagged GPU at Fry's. At that point, Mike, you are treading on *very* thin ice. With Intel having released the complete source to their chipsets and with the number of totally free 3D drivers that don't slag GPU's... However - if the hardware is really that fickle then why is it on the market? Yes, it can run hot enough to slag itself - all modern CPU's run the same risk. Yet people, mostly the "Power Gamers", will push a CPU beyond their rated spec's and have it riding the edge of thermal breakdown. Because of the nature of the 3D accelerator market most manufacturers (of the chips themselves) have already pushed their chips to that thermal edge, and some of the makers of the boards will even provide the end user means to push the chips even further. However, even *with* some hardware manufacturers providing a way for the end-user to do it, pushing the componets to the edge of thermal breakdown (or beyond and keeping them in check through an active cooling system) is not "normal and expected use". As well, if the that is the argument that NVidia and ATI use (that they are worried about people recompiling the code with busy-loops stripped out) then they don't know the Open Source community well. In general the people that are most likely to recompile the driver with the busy-loops removed don't run Open Source systems - they run Windows. Those people are called "competetive gamers" and 99% of the games they play are only available for Windows. What I'm trying to say is: Just like the "It gives away too much information on our IP" claim, the "People will recompile it with code needed to keep it from destroying itself" claim is bunk. Even moreso if their code is documented well enough that the purpose of the busy-wait loop is clear. DRH - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/