Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1758206AbXE3Uqn (ORCPT ); Wed, 30 May 2007 16:46:43 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1753786AbXE3Uqg (ORCPT ); Wed, 30 May 2007 16:46:36 -0400 Received: from smtp1.linux-foundation.org ([207.189.120.13]:38804 "EHLO smtp1.linux-foundation.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1753409AbXE3Uqf (ORCPT ); Wed, 30 May 2007 16:46:35 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 13:44:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Linus Torvalds To: Eric Dumazet cc: Davide Libenzi , Ingo Molnar , Ulrich Drepper , Jeff Garzik , Zach Brown , Linux Kernel Mailing List , Arjan van de Ven , Christoph Hellwig , Andrew Morton , Alan Cox , Evgeniy Polyakov , "David S. Miller" , Suparna Bhattacharya , Jens Axboe , Thomas Gleixner Subject: Re: Syslets, Threadlets, generic AIO support, v6 In-Reply-To: <465DDF0A.8080107@cosmosbay.com> Message-ID: References: <20070529212718.GH7875@mami.zabbo.net> <465CA654.5000505@garzik.org> <20070530072055.GA3077@elte.hu> <465D286E.2080807@redhat.com> <20070530084252.GA15708@elte.hu> <465DDF0A.8080107@cosmosbay.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="-1463790079-1113153342-1180557882=:26602" Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 1749 Lines: 46 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. ---1463790079-1113153342-1180557882=:26602 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Wed, 30 May 2007, Eric Dumazet wrote: > > > > No, Davide, the problem is that some applications depend on getting > > _specific_ file descriptors. > > Fix the application, and not adding kernel bloat ? No. The application is _correct_. It's how file descriptors are defined to work. > Then you can also exclude multi-threading, since a thread (even not inside > glibc) can also use socket()/pipe()/open()/whatever and take the zero file > descriptor as well. Totally different. That's an application internal issue. It does *not* mean that we can break existing standards. > The only hardcoded thing in Unix is 0, 1 and 2 fds. Wrong. I already gave an example of real code that just didn't bother to keep track of which fd's it had open, and closed them all. Partly, in fact, because you can't even _know_ which fd's you have open when somebody else just execve's you. You can call it buggy, but the fact is, if you do, you're SIMPLY WRONG. You cannot just change years and years of coding practice, and standard documentations. The behaviour of file descriptors is a fact. Ignoring that fact because you don't like it is na?ve and simply not realistic. Linus ---1463790079-1113153342-1180557882=:26602-- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/