Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1759186AbXFQBuj (ORCPT ); Sat, 16 Jun 2007 21:50:39 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1757723AbXFQBuc (ORCPT ); Sat, 16 Jun 2007 21:50:32 -0400 Received: from mx1.redhat.com ([66.187.233.31]:38172 "EHLO mx1.redhat.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1757014AbXFQBub (ORCPT ); Sat, 16 Jun 2007 21:50:31 -0400 To: Daniel Hazelton Cc: Bron Gondwana , Ingo Molnar , Alan Cox , Linus Torvalds , Greg KH , debian developer , david@lang.hm, Tarkan Erimer , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Andrew Morton Subject: Re: Dual-Licensing Linux Kernel with GPL V2 and GPL V3 References: <200706161431.58245.dhazelton@enter.net> <200706161817.36657.dhazelton@enter.net> From: Alexandre Oliva Organization: Red Hat OS Tools Group Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2007 22:49:56 -0300 In-Reply-To: <200706161817.36657.dhazelton@enter.net> (Daniel Hazelton's message of "Sat\, 16 Jun 2007 18\:17\:36 -0400") Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.0.990 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 3490 Lines: 86 On Jun 16, 2007, Daniel Hazelton wrote: > On Saturday 16 June 2007 15:27:37 Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> On Jun 16, 2007, Daniel Hazelton wrote: >> > I don't see how TiVO has done this. They have placed no restrictions on >> > *modification* at all. What they have done is placed a restriction on >> > *REPLACEMENT* of the program. >> >> Technicality. In order for the software to remain free (which is what >> the GPL is all about), the user must not be stopped from adapting the >> software to suit his needs and running it for any purpose. TiVo >> places restrictions on it. It's really this simple. > Your arguments are all based on technicalities, so why are you complaining > when I do the same? My arguments are based on the intent behind the license, its spirit. You keep falling back to legal technicalities, that have zero to do with the interpretation of the intent. That's why. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_and_spirit_of_the_law > As it stands there is *NOTHING* that singular distinction makes all the > difference in the world. What you are arguing - based on your *BELIEF* that > such *REPLACEMENT* is a modification. Maybe modification is not the best word, because it carries a lot of legal background from copyright law. How about adaptation. From freedom #1, freedom to study the software and adapt it to your needs. Do you see how tivoization imposes an artificial restriction to this freedom? > If you want I'll go dig out the exact place where RMS said that he > didn't care about hardware. This is still true. This is not about the hardware. This is about the software, and how the user is stopped from adapting it to her own needs, while the vendor saves this prerogative to itself. > That your right to configure a device ends at the point where it > connects to a network? Well, unless you want to sacrifice *ALL* the > stuff that makes a TiVO actually worth using, you *HAVE* to connect > it to their network. So, if you visit www.fsfla.org, I 0w|\| your computer? If you join a bit torrent, I can replace the operating system on your computer? Sorry, I don't buy that. You're leaving something out of this picture, and that's probably quite important. >> If these are not restrictions on the freedoms that the GPL is designed >> to protect to ensure that Free Software remains Free for all its >> users, I don't know what is. > "Free as in beer" is the phrasing used, I believe. Huh? Are you implying that the Free Software foundation wrote this meaning "zero cost"? > If you have such a respect for peoples freedoms - and I don't doubt > that you actually believe you do - then why are you stripping > freedoms from people? Because they're disrespecting others' freedoms. Freedoms aren't absolute. One's freedom ends where another's freedom starts. Tivoization exceeds the hardware manufacturer's freedoms and disrespects users' freedoms and disrespect some author's ethical intent. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.lsd.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ FSF Latin America Board Member http://www.fsfla.org/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/