Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1760227AbXFQNSO (ORCPT ); Sun, 17 Jun 2007 09:18:14 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1759396AbXFQNR7 (ORCPT ); Sun, 17 Jun 2007 09:17:59 -0400 Received: from wa-out-1112.google.com ([209.85.146.181]:8701 "EHLO wa-out-1112.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1754287AbXFQNR6 (ORCPT ); Sun, 17 Jun 2007 09:17:58 -0400 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=J/HY1QHPC+3toATiYDGJ6Z54gryEsrAvF0icu4ZZmOAPFOmBehQ4xvPVehwcKsgpKn6XfNkKTVIXJ9vvYLiwiqnTNudxaTFxbuKEaOGWTdXvLrJynSTLziOmuQVeCT8PktdZmEiVumPXpz7dVn8Qjk/zHSLSWdG2I/6B6Xtp2pQ= Message-ID: <6bffcb0e0706170617k32e79d96q5af1bcd7d9492cb8@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 15:17:58 +0200 From: "Michal Piotrowski" To: "Adrian Bunk" Subject: Re: [PATCH] (Re: regression tracking (Re: Linux 2.6.21)) Cc: "Stefan Richter" , "Oleg Verych" , "Linus Torvalds" , "Andi Kleen" , "Rafael J. Wysocki" , "Diego Calleja" , "Chuck Ebbert" , "Linux Kernel Mailing List" , "Andrew Morton" In-Reply-To: <20070617124508.GV3588@stusta.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <200704291849.23197.rjw@sisk.pl> <20070615234202.GP3588@stusta.de> <20070616013236.GA16016@flower.upol.cz> <4673D63D.5020804@s5r6.in-berlin.de> <20070617004436.GU3588@stusta.de> <467501D0.3090203@googlemail.com> <20070617124508.GV3588@stusta.de> Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 2980 Lines: 81 On 17/06/07, Adrian Bunk wrote: > On Sun, Jun 17, 2007 at 11:41:36AM +0200, Michal Piotrowski wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > Adrian Bunk pisze: > >> On Sat, Jun 16, 2007 at 02:23:25PM +0200, Stefan Richter wrote: > >>> ... > >>> [Adrian, I'm not saying "too few users run -rc kernels", I'm saying "too > >>> few FireWire driver users run -rc kernels".] > >> Getting more people testing -rc kernels might be possible, and I don't > >> think it would be too hard. And not only FireWire would benefit from this, > >> remember e.g. that at least 2 out of the last 5 kernels Linus released > >> contained filesystem corruption regressions. > >> The problem is that we aren't able to handle the many regression reports > >> we get today, so asking for more testing and regression reports today > >> would attack it at the wrong part of the chain. > >> Additionally, every reported and unhandled regression will frustrate the > >> reporter - never forget that we have _many_ unhandled bug reports > >> (including but not limited to regression reports) where the submitter > >> spent much time and energy in writing a good bug report. > >> If we somehow gain the missing manpower for debugging regressions we can > >> actively ask for more testing. Missing manpower (of people knowing some > >> part of the kernel well) for debugging bug reports is IMHO the one big > >> source of quality problems in the Linux kernel. If we get this solved, > >> things like getting more testers for -rc kernels will become low hanging > >> fruits. > > > > Adrian, I agree with _all_ your points. > > > > I bet that developers will hate me for this. > > > > Please consider for 2.6.23 > > Fine with me, but: > > There are not so simple cases like big infrastructure patches with > 20 other patches in the tree depending on it causing a regression, or > even worse, a big infrastructure patch exposing a latent old bug in some > completely different area of the kernel. It is different case. "If the patch introduces a new regression" introduces != exposes an old bug Removal of 20 patches will be painful, but sometimes you need to "choose minor evil to prevent a greater one" [1]. > And we should be aware that reverting is only a workaround for the real > problem which lies in our bug handling. > > > Regards, > > Michal > >... > > cu > Adrian > > -- > > "Is there not promise of rain?" Ling Tan asked suddenly out > of the darkness. There had been need of rain for many days. > "Only a promise," Lao Er said. > Pearl S. Buck - Dragon Seed > > Regards, Michal [1] the quote from "The Last Wish/Minor Evil" by Andrzej Sapkowski :) -- LOG http://www.stardust.webpages.pl/log/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/