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Subject: Re: Planned changes for bugzilla.kernel.org to reduce the "Bugzilla
 blues"
From:   Slade Watkins <srw@sladewatkins.net>
In-Reply-To: <YzeVVV+nPaxsqS0V@mit.edu>
Date:   Fri, 30 Sep 2022 22:47:20 -0400
Cc:     Laurent Pinchart <laurent.pinchart@ideasonboard.com>,
        "Artem S. Tashkinov" <aros@gmx.com>,
        "Bird, Tim" <Tim.Bird@sony.com>,
        Thorsten Leemhuis <linux@leemhuis.info>,
        Konstantin Ryabitsev <konstantin@linuxfoundation.org>,
        "workflows@vger.kernel.org" <workflows@vger.kernel.org>,
        LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
        Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
        Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>,
        "regressions@lists.linux.dev" <regressions@lists.linux.dev>,
        "ksummit@lists.linux.dev" <ksummit@lists.linux.dev>
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To:     Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu>
Precedence: bulk

Hey there:

> On Sep 30, 2022, at 9:18 PM, Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> wrote:
>=20
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 07:47:26PM +0300, Laurent Pinchart wrote:
>>> Debian uses an email based bug tracker and you know what? Most =
people
>>> avoid it like a plague. It's a hell on earth to use. Ubunutu's =
Launchpad
>>> which looks and feels like Bugzilla is a hundred times more popular.
>>=20
>> It would be pretty sad if the only options we could come up with for =
bug
>> tracking would be either popular with reporters and ignored by
>> maintainers, or the other way around. Ideally we wouldn't have to =
decide
>> which of those two classes of users to prioritize, but I fear that,
>> given resource starvation, we'll have to make a decision there that =
will
>> be unpopular with one of the two sides.
>=20
> Funny thing.  I've largely given up on getting any kind of useful bug
> report from Launchpad, so I've largely ignored it.  In contast, the
> bug reports I get for e2fsprogs from Debian are generally far more
> actionable, with bug reports that have all of the data so I can
> actually root cause the problem, and help the user.

Yeah, this all comes down to personal preference and experience. For =
instance, that hasn=E2=80=99t been my experience and I happen to like =
Launchpad=E2=80=99s layout for reports, but I can see why you=E2=80=99d =
feel that way. (Different roles, different experiences, so-to-speak.)

> So Launchpad may be pretty, but perhaps because of selection bias, the
> bug reports I've seen there are generally a waste of my time, and if
> I'm going to choose which users I'm going to help for ***free***, it's
> going to be the one which is far less frustrating to me as the
> volunteer.

Yep, valid point there.=20

> "100 times more popular" is not necessarily a feature if what we get
> is 1000 times the noise.

I mean, I get it. And, obviously, something like Launchpad isn=E2=80=99t =
going to scale the way that it needs to in order for it to work for =
this. =20

Not everyone is going to like whatever solution is put in place, if =
there=E2=80=99s even any solution put in place: there will always be =
complaints from folks.

*Sigh.*

-srw