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Date:   Fri, 5 May 2023 14:46:58 -0700
From:   Boqun Feng <boqun.feng@gmail.com>
To:     Keith Busch <kbusch@kernel.org>
Cc:     Miguel Ojeda <miguel.ojeda.sandonis@gmail.com>,
        Jens Axboe <axboe@kernel.dk>,
        Bart Van Assche <bvanassche@acm.org>,
        Andreas Hindborg <nmi@metaspace.dk>,
        Christoph Hellwig <hch@lst.de>,
        Damien Le Moal <Damien.LeMoal@wdc.com>,
        Hannes Reinecke <hare@suse.de>,
        lsf-pc@lists.linux-foundation.org, rust-for-linux@vger.kernel.org,
        linux-block@vger.kernel.org, Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>,
        Miguel Ojeda <ojeda@kernel.org>,
        Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor@gmail.com>,
        Wedson Almeida Filho <wedsonaf@gmail.com>,
        Gary Guo <gary@garyguo.net>,
        =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn?= Roy Baron <bjorn3_gh@protonmail.com>,
        Benno Lossin <benno.lossin@proton.me>,
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        Daniel Vetter <daniel@ffwll.ch>
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 00/11] Rust null block driver
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On Fri, May 05, 2023 at 01:42:42PM -0600, Keith Busch wrote:
> On Fri, May 05, 2023 at 05:24:56AM -0700, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > 
> > The Rust bindings are actually the way of communication between
> > subsystem mantainers and Rust driver writers, and can help reduce the
> > amount of work: You can have the abstraction the way you like.
> 
> We don't have stable APIs or structures here, so let's be clear-eyed

Of course, but every API change need to cover all in-tree users, right?

> about the maintenance burden these bindings create for linux-block
> contributors. Not a hard "no" from me, but this isn't something to
> handwave over.

Not tried to handwave over anything ;-) The fact IIUC is simply that Rust
drivers can call C function, so say a in-tree Rust driver does something
as follow:

	struct Foo {
		ptr: *mut bio; // A pointer to bio.
		...
	}

	impl Foo {
		pub fn bar(&self) {
			unsafe {
				// calling a C function "do_sth_to_bio".
				// void do_sth_to_bio(struct bio *bio);
				bindings::do_sth_to_bio(self.ptr);
			}
		}
	}

That's an user of the block layer, and that user could exist even
without Bio abstraction. And whenever a linux-block developer wants to
refactor the "do_sth_to_bio" with a slightly different semantics, that
user will need to be taken into consideration, meaning reading the Rust
code of Foo to understand the usage.

Now with a Bio abstraction, the immediate effect would be there should
be no Rust code is allowed to directly calls block layer functions
without using Bio abstraction. And hopefully Bio abstraction along with
other bindings is a place good enough to reasoning about semanitcs
changes or refactoring, so no need to read the code of Foo to understand
the usage. Of course, some C side changes may result into changes in
Rust bindings as well, but that doesn't make things worse. (Need to
understand Foo in that case if there is no Rust bindings).

Of course, this is just my 2 cents. I could be completely wrong.
(Put the Rust-for-Linux hat on) Needless to say with or without the Rust
bindings for the block layer, we are (at least I'm) happy to help on any
Rust related questions/bugs/issues for linux-block ;-)

Regards,
Boqun