Message-ID: <473AE565.9050306@keyaccess.nl>
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:09:09 +0100
From: Rene Herman <rene.herman@keyaccess.nl>
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To: David Miller <davem@davemloft.net>
CC: rmk+lkml@arm.linux.org.uk, alsa-devel@alsa-project.org,
       netdev@vger.kernel.org, linux-pcmcia@lists.infradead.org,
       linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, protasnb@gmail.com,
       linux-ide@vger.kernel.org, bugme-daemon@bugzilla.kernel.org,
       linux-input@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz, akpm@linux-foundation.org,
       perex@suse.cz, tiwai@suse.de
Subject: Re: [alsa-devel] [BUG] New Kernel Bugs
References: <20071114095507.GA32595@flint.arm.linux.org.uk>	<20071114.020706.219917088.davem@davemloft.net>	<473AE010.4090806@keyaccess.nl> <20071114.035657.121841024.davem@davemloft.net>
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On 14-11-07 12:56, David Miller wrote:

> From: Rene Herman <rene.herman@keyaccess.nl>
> Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 12:46:24 +0100
> 
>> alsa-devel@alsa-project.org is not subscriber-only. Same as that arm list, 
>> it's _moderated_ for non-subscribers and given that I and other moderators 
>> have been doing our best to moderate quickly (I tend to stay logged in to 
>> the moderation interface all day for example) what specifically bugged the 
>> crap out of you? It's not something a poster needs to concern himself with.
> 
> The fact that it farts at me every time I post to this thread.  That's
> rude and annoying.

It certainly is. I only experienced that now due to the "too many recipients 
to message" moderation notice that I got from my own message.

Jaroslav -- please disable that junk or if possible, make it a "at most once 
per address per month" thing or somesuch. This is complete crap.

>> Also for alsa-devel the moderators tend to add any valid non-subcribers to 
>> a whitelist after landing in the queue the first time meaning even a delay 
>> is just a one-time thing normally. So what's the trouble? Basically, noone 
>> need even notice...
> 
> That sucks for new people taking part in the conversation.
> 
> There is no reason for moderation at all, it isn't necessary
> for spam prevention and it does nothing but annoy new posters
> and make work for the moderator.

Yes there is. It's necessary for lists that do not have the human and other 
resouces behind it that vger does. alsa-devel was drowning in spam and dying 
as a result back when it was at sourceforge. Upon moving, my preference was 
to ask the lists to be hosted at vger but given that (it seems) Jaroslav 
wanted to keep them locally, moderation was very necessary. I moderate out 
quite a bit of spam every day.

vger is doing an amazing job at spam filtering -- if it's an option to move 
to vger, than sure, no need. But otherwise, the "no need" needs a list admin 
with enough bandwidth and skill.

As to the "new people": it's not optimal, but (upto this thread I'll admit 
-- I woke up to a huge number of posts in the queue) it's not been a _real_ 
problem. alsa-devel is not high-volume enough for it to be.

Rene.

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