Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1755279AbYHSW1R (ORCPT ); Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:27:17 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1752028AbYHSW06 (ORCPT ); Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:26:58 -0400 Received: from relay.2ka.mipt.ru ([194.85.80.65]:48414 "EHLO 2ka.mipt.ru" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751923AbYHSW04 (ORCPT ); Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:26:56 -0400 Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:26:12 +0400 From: Evgeniy Polyakov To: Linus Torvalds Cc: David Miller , akpm@linux-foundation.org, netdev@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: [GIT]: Networking Message-ID: <20080819222612.GA16766@2ka.mipt.ru> References: <20080819.142735.179034162.davem@davemloft.net> <20080819.144015.40311904.davem@davemloft.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 2380 Lines: 45 On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 02:50:36PM -0700, Linus Torvalds (torvalds@linux-foundation.org) wrote: > And the thing is, you cannot. Some of the ones I pointed you to were > actually regressions due to _other_ patches you had much too happily sent > me after the merge window had already closed). ... phisiological thoughts skipped ... > Please. You're still making excuses for this, even after I pointed out > that ALL of the problems with the whole loopback driver thing happened > after the merge window. I belive it was you who told that there is no black and white (another guy told that there is no spoon, I frequntly confuse). Any changes made no matter when can not be 100% tested in laboratory environment, even fixes, which look obviously. Even changes which do fix some problems can introduce another. And some fixes can introduce problems, which are not immediately shown in majority of the tests, so changes on top of them can look like introducing new bugs. If you have multiple changes and result which produce an error, it does not mean that the last one was wrong. Of course it can, but 'there is no black and white', and in really complex system only trivial changes can be thought of not touching others. The same applies to loopback. So this particular note is just about the fact, that fixing regression means either reverting a change or introducing a new change. The latter is preferred (or at least should be), since it is a move forward. According to other changes, which you believe are not suitable for the post merge window releases... People do know that major changes are not allowed to be made, but there are always last strikes in the head which are supposed to fix problems, not to introduce new ones. Where did you see experimental code in -rc cycle? Where did you see patches which break things without bringing improvement at that time? Yes, there changes which are not supposed to be in the tree at that time, but that's just a development process, which even in a short run makes good result. Regressions and bugs are fixed, and things are not getting worse with time. -- Evgeniy Polyakov -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/