Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Tue, 29 Jan 2002 17:15:33 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Tue, 29 Jan 2002 17:15:16 -0500 Received: from www.transvirtual.com ([206.14.214.140]:4110 "EHLO www.transvirtual.com") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Tue, 29 Jan 2002 17:15:04 -0500 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 14:14:57 -0800 (PST) From: James Simmons To: Linux Kernel Mailing List Subject: MAINTANIANCE [was Re: A modest proposal -- We need a patch penguin] In-Reply-To: <20020129075245.GA15419@kroah.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org > I'm not proposing replacing the current subsystem maintainers. But are the > current subsystem maintainers happy? Usually I don't get involved in these discussions but I like to share my experiences here and I also like for people see it from the point of view of Linus. A few years ago I got involved with developement of the framebuffer layer. Now I work along with Geert on the improvement of this subsystem. Do I consider myself a maintainer? Its just a title. All I know is I work with Geert on this stuff. He has been doing that subsystem alot longer than I have been and I have the up most high respect for him. So I would never do anything without his okay. One thing I can tell you is both me and Geert have jobs that don't pay us to work directly on this (it would be nice HINT!!!!) . We do it out of our free time. Unfortunely our free time is limited. I know I as well as Geert receive email from various people on how to write drivers or even recieve a bunch of patches. I have tried to look at every patch and read every email. I can tell you it is so hard. Often I don't reply for days or even weeks at a time. I feel bad sometimes about this but I can't help it. BTW I don't ever ignore any emails. They might sit there for some time but eventually I do answer them. Plus I do keep every patch I have been sent. I even have been sent free hardware to test people's work on. I have hardware I have been sitting around for several months ago but because I'm so swamp I just don't get the time to test things on it. Another thing I have experienced is having my head bite off by driver writers when I reworked their code or told them this is the way the code should be written. As for Linus trusting or not trusting me. I hope he doesn't trust me because I don't even trust myself sometimes. That is why I like to send out my stuff on mailing list for people to see it. So people can voice their options and I do see improvements. I'm thankful for trees like DJ and alan's because I get to see a large audience test it. I have sent in patches for the dj that worked for me and for a bunch of other people it blew up. I see it as a much needed test bed. Only when nearly everyone that is affected by my work is happy I would consider it worthy to send to Linus. I can't even imagine being Linus. First we do see him getting flamed for wanting things a certain way or reworking someone else code. This can be good if done right. Second he recieves alot of patches every day. I don't blame him for not looking at a lot of them. In fact I wouldn't doubt he has a filter for the people he trust to go int one box and the others go into another box. What is the solution for this problem? With my expeirences I have come up with I found the following to work best. Unfortunely not all have been applied to fbdev developement but I'm pushing it this way. These are the goals I'm aiming for. ----------------------- For new device drivers --------------------------- I. First we have setup a mailing list for this. He driver writers can post their drivers for code review and testing. II. Second step is to place it in a area where people know here to go for the latest thing. For fbdev we have setup a CVS where people can ask for CVS access and can place their driver their. I like to do it this way because it is way to hard for me to track every patch. Plus we have had several people write the same driver independent of each other. III. Place it in a beta tree. Announce it to the world. IV. The maintainer submits it to Linus. ----------------------- API changes -------------------------------------- I. Post a proposal on a mailing list for that subsystem. II. Everyone comments. Go to 1 until most people are happy. III. Next a document maintiner steps forward to write real docs. (We haven't done this). I really think every subsystem needs this. IV. Start making patches and do above. . --- |o_o | |:_/ | Give Micro$oft the Bird!!!! // \ \ Use Linux!!!! (| | ) /'_ _/`\ ___)=(___/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/