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Message-ID: <18756.23327.478759.5970@cargo.ozlabs.ibm.com>
Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:02:23 +1100
From: Paul Mackerras <paulus@samba.org>
To: Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@chello.nl>
Cc: eranian@gmail.com, Vince Weaver <vince@deater.net>,
       Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
       Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
       Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
       Eric Dumazet <dada1@cosmosbay.com>,
       Robert Richter <robert.richter@amd.com>,
       Arjan van de Veen <arjan@infradead.org>, Peter Anvin <hpa@zytor.com>,
       "David S. Miller" <davem@davemloft.net>
Subject: Re: [patch] Performance Counters for Linux, v3
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Peter Zijlstra writes:

> On Fri, 2008-12-12 at 18:42 +0100, stephane eranian wrote:
> > In fact, I know tools which do not even need a library. 
> 
> By your own saying, the problem solved by libperfmon is a hard problem
> (and I fully understand that).
> 
> Now you say there is software out there that doesn't use libperfmon,
> that means they'll have to duplicate that functionality.
> 
> And only commercial software has a clear gain by wastefully duplicating
> that effort. This means there is an active commercial interest to not
> make perfmon the best technical solution there is, which is contrary to
> the very thing Linux is about.
> 
> What is worse, you defend that:
> 
> > Go ask end-users what they think of that?
> > 
> > You don't even need a library. All of this could be integrated into the tool.
> > New processor, just go download the updated version of the tool.
> 
> No! what people want is their problem fixed - no matter how. That is one
> of the powers of FOSS, you can fix your problems in any way suitable.
> 
> Would it not be much better if those folks duped into using a binary
> only product only had to upgrade their FOSS kernel, instead of possibly
> forking over more $$$ for an upgrade?
> 
> You have just irrevocably proven to me this needs to go into the kernel,
> as the design of perfmon is little more than a GPL circumvention device
> - independent of whether you are aware of that or not.

I'm sorry, but that is a pretty silly argument.

By that logic, the kernel module loader should include an in-kernel
copy of gcc and binutils, and the fact that it doesn't proves that the
module loader is little more than a GPL circumvention device -
independent of whether you are aware of that or not.  8-)

Paul.
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