Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1754634AbZC0SvR (ORCPT ); Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:51:17 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1753963AbZC0SvA (ORCPT ); Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:51:00 -0400 Received: from smtp1.linux-foundation.org ([140.211.169.13]:52941 "EHLO smtp1.linux-foundation.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1753936AbZC0SvA (ORCPT ); Fri, 27 Mar 2009 14:51:00 -0400 Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 11:40:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Linus Torvalds X-X-Sender: torvalds@localhost.localdomain To: Alan Cox cc: Matthew Garrett , Theodore Tso , Andrew Morton , David Rees , Jesper Krogh , Linux Kernel Mailing List Subject: Re: Linux 2.6.29 In-Reply-To: <20090327183214.2e73b6a3@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> Message-ID: References: <20090327051338.GP6239@mit.edu> <20090327055750.GA18065@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327062114.GA18290@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327112438.GQ6239@mit.edu> <20090327145156.GB24819@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327150811.09b313f5@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> <20090327152221.GA25234@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327161553.31436545@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> <20090327162841.GA26860@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327165150.7e69d9e1@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> <20090327170208.GA27646@srcf.ucam.org> <20090327183214.2e73b6a3@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (LFD 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 1056 Lines: 30 On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alan Cox wrote: > > > So the fact is, "people should always use fsync" simply isn't a realistic > > expectation, nor is it historically accurate. > > Far too many people don't - and it is unfortunate but people should learn > to write quality software. You're ignoring reality. Your definition of "quality software" is PURE SH*T. Look at that laptop disk spinup issue. Look at the performance issue. Look at something as nebulous as "usability". If adding fsync's makes software unusable (and it does), then you shouldn't call that "quality software". Alan, just please face that reality, and think about it for a moment. If fsync() was instantaneous, this discussion wouldn't exist. But read the thread. We're talking 3-5s under NORMAL load, with peaks of minutes. Linus -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/