Message-ID: <4188788C3E1BD411AA60009027E92DFD06307869@loisexc2.loislaw.com>
From: "Rose, Billy" <wrose@loislaw.com>
To: "'root@chaos.analogic.com'" <root@chaos.analogic.com>,
        Pavel Machek <pavel@suse.cz>
Cc: Andreas Ferber <aferber@techfak.uni-bielefeld.de>,
        linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: RE: ext3 and undeletion
Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:04:11 -0600 
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org

To me, Linux is about freedom. As we all know, freedom comes with a price.
My company has users that sit on Win9x boxes and use Explorer to connect to
a set of Netware boxes. These boxes house critical data. I didn't create
this system, it grew to what it is before my time. If it were up to me, all
of the users would be running Emacs or some other great editor (vim is my
favorite), and connect to a Linux machine via CVS with a Linux box to alter
files so there is little chance they could crap out the file system, or
delete files without knowing it. Explorer is one of those M$ monsters that,
under the right circumstances, grabs an entire tree and grinds it up into
the digital void. The users in question are at these moments little more
than automatons from editing hundreds, perhaps even a thousand, files in
some 8 hour span of time. These users don't even have the DOS prompt in
their Start menu, let alone the time to mess with it. Bottom line: Linux is
not being used for file servers in my company because this feature is not
present. We are _not_ talking about a windblows trashcan here, we are
talking about short term enterprise class file recovery as implemented in
Netware. This was my intention when I brought the whole issue up on this
list. We don't need a windows garbage can (unless you mean literally :), we
need file recovery at the sysadmin level without going to the tapes as
often. In order for Linux to take over the planet (my dream), then all of
the features that keep companies tied to an OS needs to be addressed. This
issue is one such company tie.

Billy Rose

P.S. I got 2981.88 BogoMIPS today from a new install of RedHat 7.2 on a P4
1.5Ghz!

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard B. Johnson [mailto:root@chaos.analogic.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 4:07 PM
To: Pavel Machek
Cc: Andreas Ferber; linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: ext3 and undeletion


On Mon, 4 Mar 2002, Pavel Machek wrote:

> Hi
> > > All the deleted files, with the correct path(s), are now in the
> > > top directory file the file-system ../lost+found directory. They
> > > are still owned by the original user, still subject to the same
> > > quota.
> > 
> > And what about:
> > 
> > - Luser rm's "foo.c"
> > - Luser starts working on new version of "foo.c"
> > - Luser recognizes, that the old version was better
> > - Luser rm's new "foo.c"
> > - Luser tries to unrm the old "foo.c" -> *bang*
> > 
> > Trust me, there /will/ be a luser who tries to do it this way. If
> > teaching lusers were enough, you'd have no need for an unrm at all.
> 
> You don't consider me a luser, right?

Nope.

Some newbees think that Windoze 'send-to-the-wastebasket' is a kernel-
level "safe-delete". It's just some ^&$)##*@*) program that slows most
of us down.

Even Windows/Professional/2000 (NT) developers knew that it was
garbage. If you've figured out how to get to the CMD prompt, just
type:

cd \
rm -r *.*
 |  |   |______ They still have dots
 |  |__________ Yes, even "folders" <coff, coff>
 |_____________ What do you expect for a stolen OS? Yes, `rm` instead of
                del, following the Unix pathname tradition.

Cheers,
Dick Johnson

Penguin : Linux version 2.4.18 on an i686 machine (799.53 BogoMips).

	Bill Gates? Who?

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