Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S932211AbZFLDWR (ORCPT ); Thu, 11 Jun 2009 23:22:17 -0400 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1751711AbZFLDWH (ORCPT ); Thu, 11 Jun 2009 23:22:07 -0400 Received: from hawking.rebel.net.au ([203.20.69.83]:49036 "EHLO hawking.rebel.net.au" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751611AbZFLDWG (ORCPT ); Thu, 11 Jun 2009 23:22:06 -0400 Message-ID: <4A31C9D6.7070707@davidnewall.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 12:51:58 +0930 From: David Newall User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (X11/20090318) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Linus Torvalds CC: Pekka Enberg , Christoph Hellwig , Peter Zijlstra , Al Viro , Ingo Molnar , "David S. Miller" , Stephane Eranian , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Paul Mackerras , Andrew Morton , Thomas Gleixner Subject: Re: [GIT PULL] Performance Counters for Linux References: <20090611160329.GA3366@elte.hu> <20090611161714.GA5008@infradead.org> <20090611165226.GV8633@ZenIV.linux.org.uk> <1244739378.6691.540.camel@laptop> <20090611170015.GA3651@infradead.org> <84144f020906111059g6e25a090y4434cfd698f84fb4@mail.gmail.com> <4A3148AA.9000007@davidnewall.com> <4A314F37.2080202@davidnewall.com> <4A3155E3.3030603@davidnewall.com> <4A315C9F.8050908@davidnewall.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Content-Length: 2194 Lines: 46 Linus Torvalds wrote: > On Fri, 12 Jun 2009, David Newall wrote: >> Linus Torvalds wrote: >> >>> To take the oprofile example that decided it for me: the code to actually >>> support new processors was all done by basically kernel developers. And it >>> didn't hit user land for almost a year, because the user-land tools didn't >>> take the patch and propagate it up. >>> >> Bad developer, Spot, you only did half the job. Not sure there's much >> more one can say. >> > > Umm. The kernel developer _did_ do the job. The patch to the user land > side was available for that whole year. I don't know this oprofile problem you had, only what you've said, which is that somebody* did the kernel bit and somebody else did the userspace bit; and the person doing the userspace bit was unresponsive so good stuff got ignored for a year. That situation did not occur because the userspace was out-of-tree, it occurred because you let it. You could have given the userspace (back) to the kernel developer. That's what you'd eventually do if a kernel sub-system maintainer became unresponsive, isn't it? *the singular is intended to include the plural and the male to include female. > Anyway, it's clearly not worth discussing this with you. I've tried. I > give up. Happily, I don't _need_ to convince you. Indeed, no, you don't need to convince me, particularly as I've made it abundantly clear that I'm entirely happy with your decision. Notice I've not argued with you, merely pointed out inconsistencies in what you've said. I realise that can be annoying, and acknowledge your absolute right to be as consistent or inconsistent as you choose. I wasn't (and still aren't) trying to be annoying, but to confirm there was no confusion. If you hadn't seen these inconsistencies before, you surely do now. That actually should be worth your while. I personally welcome being corrected; andconsider that a trait of an open mind. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/