Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id ; Sat, 16 Mar 2002 16:07:11 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id ; Sat, 16 Mar 2002 16:07:01 -0500 Received: from vindaloo.ras.ucalgary.ca ([136.159.55.21]:22725 "EHLO vindaloo.ras.ucalgary.ca") by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id ; Sat, 16 Mar 2002 16:06:42 -0500 Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 14:05:17 -0700 Message-Id: <200203162105.g2GL5H914363@vindaloo.ras.ucalgary.ca> From: Richard Gooch To: yodaiken@fsmlabs.com Cc: Andi Kleen , Paul Mackerras , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, torvalds@transmeta.com Subject: Re: [Lse-tech] Re: 10.31 second kernel compile In-Reply-To: <20020316134732.C21439@hq.fsmlabs.com> In-Reply-To: <20020316113536.A19495@hq.fsmlabs.com.suse.lists.linux.kernel> <20020316115726.B19495@hq.fsmlabs.com.suse.lists.linux.kernel> <20020316125711.B20436@hq.fsmlabs.com> <20020316210504.A24097@wotan.suse.de> <20020316131219.C20436@hq.fsmlabs.com> <200203162027.g2GKRqf13432@vindaloo.ras.ucalgary.ca> <20020316134732.C21439@hq.fsmlabs.com> Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org yodaiken@fsmlabs.com writes: > On Sat, Mar 16, 2002 at 01:27:52PM -0700, Richard Gooch wrote: > > yodaiken@fsmlabs.com writes: > > > On Sat, Mar 16, 2002 at 09:05:04PM +0100, Andi Kleen wrote: > > > > That will hopefully change eventually because 2M pages are a bit help for > > > > a lot of applications that are limited by TLB thrashing, but needs some > > > > thinking on how to avoid the fragmentation trap (e.g. I'm considering > > > > to add a highmem zone again just for that and use rmap with targetted > > > > physical freeing to allocating them) > > > > > > To me, once you have a G of memory, wasting a few meg on unused > > > process memory seems no big deal. > > > > I'm not happy to throw away 2 MiB per process. My workstation has 1 > > GiB of RAM, and 65 processes (and that's fairly low compared to your > > average desktop these days, because I just use olwm and don't have a > > fancy desktop or lots of windows). You want me to throw over 1/8th of > > my RAM away?!? > > Why not? If you just ran vim on console you'd be more productive and > not need all those worthless processes. Yeah, right. > At 4KB/page and 8bytes/pte a > 1G process will need at least 2MB of pte alone ! Add in the 4 layers, > the software VM struct, ... This isn't a dedicated bigass-image display box. It's a workstation. It's where I read email, hack kernels, write visualisation tools and stuff like that. And I can afford a few MiB of RAM for PTE's and such for *the one process which is mapping my huge data files*! That's effectively a small, one-time cost. Every other process doesn't have a significant PTE cost. I'm not using my kernel as a device driver for an image display programme. I'm using it run a box that's generally useful to me. > > And in fact, isn't it going to be more than 2 MiB wasted per process? > > For each shared object loaded, only partial pages are going to be > > used. *My* libc is less than 700 KiB, so I'd be wasting most of a page > > to map it in. > > You're using a politically incorrect libc. Yeah :-) Man it feels good. > But sure, big pages are not always good. Hm. With wide TLB's, what are the benefits to big pages? One pathological case that hit me a few years back was a workload which bounced around in VM in a pattern that really thrash the cache due to aliasing. It wouldn't have been a problem if we had truly fully set-associative caches, rather than N-way (where N is 2, 4 or 8 usually). But big pages won't help that much here (it's just a way of reducing TLB thrash, but doesn't help with cache thrashing). Regards, Richard.... Permanent: rgooch@atnf.csiro.au Current: rgooch@ras.ucalgary.ca - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/