Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2009 19:16:38 +0100
From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>
To: "Frank Ch. Eigler" <fche@redhat.com>
Cc: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
       utrace-devel <utrace-devel@redhat.com>,
       Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>
Subject: Re: [RFC] [PATCH] In-kernel gdbstub based on utrace Infrastructure.
Message-ID: <20091210181638.GA17986@elte.hu>
References: <20091130151650.GA24316@elte.hu>
 <20091130152910.GB10331@redhat.com>
 <20091201161132.GA24897@elte.hu>
 <20091201170002.GD10331@redhat.com>
 <20091201170954.GA4699@elte.hu>
 <20091201174534.GE10331@redhat.com>
 <20091201211518.GA32376@elte.hu>
 <20091208215829.GA19793@redhat.com>
 <20091210074158.GI16874@elte.hu>
 <y0mhbryamt2.fsf@fche.csb>
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* Frank Ch. Eigler <fche@redhat.com> wrote:

> 
> Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu> writes:
> 
> > [...]  Since the speed of development in this area is truly glacial
> > at the moment and the practical advantages that i can experience
> > personally (directly as a Linux user and indirectly as a maintainer)
> > are miniscule so far, caution is warranted IMO. [...]
> 
> If the "caution" you suggest is operationally equivalent to 
> discouraging even miniscule improvements, is it any wonder that 
> progress is glacial?

I think you might be mixing up cause and causation ;-)

> The gdbstub prototype was constructed for two reasons: to demonstrate 
> utrace usage now, and in the future to be incrementally useful (over 
> ptrace, by moving into fast kernel-space operations like 
> multithreading control, gdb-tracepoint support, other stuff).  #1 is 
> about done.  With respect to #2, we can certainly commit to ongoing 
> work on improvements, provided the community shows interest and 
> goodwill.

What i'd like to see is measurable benefits to users, developers and 
maintainers. I'd like to see the same for SystemTap too btw.

	Ingo
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