From: <Tero.Kristo@nokia.com>
To: <dedekind1@gmail.com>, <npiggin@suse.de>
CC: <axboe@kernel.dk>, <linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org>,
        <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>
Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2010 09:22:16 +0200
Subject: RE: [PATCHv2 11/11] writeback: prevent unnecessary bdi threads
 wakeups
Thread-Topic: [PATCHv2 11/11] writeback: prevent unnecessary bdi threads
 wakeups
Thread-Index: Acspatlqm8dzenbQT/eGlGW7RstI0QAAbYQg
Message-ID: <1F18D6510CF0474A8C9500565A7E41A22D4D24C4C2@NOK-EUMSG-02.mgdnok.nokia.com>
References: <1279704706-1267-1-git-send-email-dedekind1@gmail.com>
	 <1279704706-1267-12-git-send-email-dedekind1@gmail.com>
	 <20100722031922.GA3446@amd> <1279781304.3044.12.camel@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <1279781304.3044.12.camel@localhost>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Content-Length: 3265
Lines: 68


>-----Original Message-----
>From: Artem Bityutskiy [mailto:dedekind1@gmail.com]
>Sent: 22 July, 2010 09:48
>To: Nick Piggin; Kristo Tero (Nokia-MS/Tampere)
>Cc: Jens Axboe; linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org; linux-
>kernel@vger.kernel.org
>Subject: Re: [PATCHv2 11/11] writeback: prevent unnecessary bdi threads
>wakeups
>
>Hi Nick,
>
>On Thu, 2010-07-22 at 13:19 +1000, Nick Piggin wrote:
>> >  out:
>> >  	spin_unlock(&inode_lock);
>> > +
>> > +	if (wakeup_bdi) {
>> > +		spin_lock(&bdi->wb_lock);
>> > +		if (!bdi->wb.task)
>> > +			wake_up_process(default_backing_dev_info.wb.task);
>> > +		else
>> > +			wake_up_process(bdi->wb.task);
>> > +		spin_unlock(&bdi->wb_lock);
>> > +	}
>> >  }
>>
>> We really want to wake up the bdi right away when first dirtying
>> the inode? I haven't looked at where the state of the bdi code is
>> now, but isn't it better to have a a delay there?
>
>Yes, I guess we want to wake up the bdi thread after 5 secs (assuming
>default settings). I could implement a "wake_up_process_delayed"
>function which would use a timer, but I think it is not necessary to
>introduce these complications. We can just wake-up the bdi thread, it'll
>find out there is nothing to do, and will go sleep for 5 secs. I think
>this is good enough.
>
>IOW, delayed wake-up is not worth the trouble.
>
>> And rather than spreading details of how bdi tasks are managed
>> would you consider putting this into its own function?
>
>Sure, will do.
>
>> Other than that, I like your patches.
>
>Thanks :-)
>
>>  Out of interest, is 5 seconds
>> very detremental to power usage? What is a reasonable goal for
>> wakeups? (eg. 95%+ of possible efficiency)
>
>I cannot tell for sure. In Nokia N900 phone we use OMAP3 and we have
>dynamic OFF-mode, so we switch off the CPU and peripherals completely
>when there is nothing to do, and SDRAM stays in low-power auto-refresh
>mode. Every useless wake-up makes us do a lot of job re-constructing the
>CPU state. I cannot tell the numbers, but I'm CCing Tero, who is working
>on OMAP3 PM and makes a lot of battery current measurements, he can
>provide some numbers.

Well, it is hard to give any good guidelines here, as it really depends on the device architecture, possible power saving modes etc., but I can give some sort of guestimate. Basically I think kernel should not generate any extra wakeups at all if it is not doing "anything too useful". In ideal world, everything should be interrupt driven as much as possible, and we would only have timers for things that are clearly visible for user, or can cause some sort of failure if neglected. Like if we ignore watchdogs, the device will reset itself.

5 seconds by itself is not that bad, the reason we want to get rid of these is that every single wakeup source cumulates. If we have 2 wakeups occurring at 5 second intervals and they are not synced, we effectively can wakeup every 2.5 seconds and so on. I guess a good target is to have 1 device level wakeup every 30 seconds or so, but due to cumulation, I tend to complain about anything that happens more often than once a minute.

-Tero

????{.n?+???????+%?????ݶ??w??{.n?+????{??G?????{ay?ʇڙ?,j??f???h?????????z_??(?階?ݢj"???m??????G????????????&???~???iO???z??v?^?m????????????I?