Return-Path: Received: from fieldses.org ([174.143.236.118]:57364 "EHLO fieldses.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1750845Ab0HPSHH (ORCPT ); Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:07:07 -0400 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:04:50 -0400 From: "J. Bruce Fields" To: Jeremy Allison Cc: Jan Engelhardt , Jeff Layton , Neil Brown , utz lehmann , Linus Torvalds , Volker.Lendecke@sernet.de, David Howells , linux-cifs@vger.kernel.org, linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, samba-technical@lists.samba.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk, linux-fsde@jasper.es Subject: Re: [PATCH 02/18] xstat: Add a pair of system calls to make extended file stats available [ver #6] Message-ID: <20100816180450.GA7764@fieldses.org> References: <20100801092529.5e6ba0e0@corrin.poochiereds.net> <20100805235218.GB31233@jeremy-laptop> <20100806133836.49757af9@notabene> <20100808121208.GA7329@jeremy-laptop> <20100808085301.24f53e5a@tlielax.poochiereds.net> <20100808130501.GA9851@jeremy-laptop> <20100813125432.GB8945@fieldses.org> <20100813175410.GA8202@samba1> <20100813191900.GB8202@samba1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: <20100813191900.GB8202@samba1> Sender: linux-nfs-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 12:19:00PM -0700, Jeremy Allison wrote: > On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 09:06:28PM +0200, Jan Engelhardt wrote: > > > > On Friday 2010-08-13 19:54, Jeremy Allison wrote: > > >On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 08:54:32AM -0400, J. Bruce Fields wrote: > > >> On Sun, Aug 08, 2010 at 06:05:01AM -0700, Jeremy Allison wrote: > > >> > We don't need to ape Windows in everything. > > >> > The coming ACL disaster will show that (we will go from an ACL > > >> > model that is slightly too complex to use, to one that is impossibly > > >> > complex to use :-). > > >> > > >> Care to elaborate? > > > > > >POSIX ACLs -> RichACLs (NT-style). Not criticising Andreas here, > > >people are asking for this. But Windows ACLs are a nightmare > > >beyond human comprehension :-). In the "too complex to be > > >usable" camp. > > > > Well, for one, ACLs in NT can be recursive IIRC. You can't say that of Linux > > ACLs - instead you have to setfacl -R and setfacl -Rd to give one user access > > to a directory and all its subdirs including future new inodes. > > You do realize that Windows does exactly the same thing under > the covers, right ? Watch SMB or SMB2 traffic between a client > and Windows server when someone changes an ACL sometime :-). Yeah. There's some explanation here: http://tools.ietf.org/search/rfc5661#section-6.4.3.2 What NT-style ACLs provide is a few bits that help a setfacl-like application decide how to propagate the change. But it's still up to the application to do the recursive traversal. --b.