Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=3.0 tests=DKIMWL_WL_HIGH,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, SPF_PASS,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90F5BC4360F for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2019 16:56:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [209.132.180.67]) by mail.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57263206DF for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2019 16:56:42 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: mail.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=oracle.com header.i=@oracle.com header.b="kkXRwlp3" Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1725959AbfDCQ4l (ORCPT ); Wed, 3 Apr 2019 12:56:41 -0400 Received: from userp2120.oracle.com ([156.151.31.85]:54782 "EHLO userp2120.oracle.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1726099AbfDCQ4l (ORCPT ); Wed, 3 Apr 2019 12:56:41 -0400 Received: from pps.filterd (userp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x33Gromo148865; Wed, 3 Apr 2019 16:56:33 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=subject : to : cc : references : from : message-id : date : mime-version : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2018-07-02; bh=vvkLKGpICLmHzthcobm4DCwVlCgFh/+luoeASLOLQs8=; b=kkXRwlp36tPgMCrZWDvFM+PZNd2y5vWzGxAAcoMkNMXTL8co3Krca+t/e4KlUXaa5p5b t/uSt3vpWgFX8ej05CQDz13QLCIjwGeGAh0G/vTFppgNdpQ/FEFIkbc0a53rZ1XHS5WT XJmlSN1UZjAHm0xnWQduc4nMmtOcsNuX+RvPuinPgs6L7D4tIzacAow+iVIXxfp9KRTU /gwWKmHbzFNVHl9gPRvMsPDzobKyvlJPN8wN8h60JIE2OQakWYArvWw00vALkQQsN7Qn n7lGjIRA7KC4wuDnGYV77t3g2PRvwShnUM7gGGb3w3xvVjqUircDVByFtLNTdhUlrkbn bA== Received: from userp3030.oracle.com (userp3030.oracle.com [156.151.31.80]) by userp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2rj13qa7cx-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 03 Apr 2019 16:56:32 +0000 Received: from pps.filterd (userp3030.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp3030.oracle.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x33GuBI4176820; Wed, 3 Apr 2019 16:56:31 GMT Received: from userv0122.oracle.com (userv0122.oracle.com [156.151.31.75]) by userp3030.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2rm8f57bcy-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 03 Apr 2019 16:56:31 +0000 Received: from abhmp0003.oracle.com (abhmp0003.oracle.com [141.146.116.9]) by userv0122.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id x33GuPjr008000; Wed, 3 Apr 2019 16:56:29 GMT Received: from bradley.us.oracle.com (/10.152.12.111) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Wed, 03 Apr 2019 09:56:25 -0700 Subject: Re: directory delegations To: "bfields@fieldses.org" , Trond Myklebust Cc: "linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org" References: <2065755c-f888-9c62-f6e5-f143d42c51ee@oracle.com> <20190402161116.GA2828@fieldses.org> <2f1f6582-3672-1361-4392-80cb1e62e19c@oracle.com> <20190402194148.GA5269@fieldses.org> <58230e155813e866cb057e6543ab7e61f51fedf6.camel@hammerspace.com> <20190403002822.GA7667@fieldses.org> <20190403020750.GA8272@fieldses.org> From: "Bradley C. Kuszmaul" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2019 12:56:24 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20190403020750.GA8272@fieldses.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=5900 definitions=9216 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1810050000 definitions=main-1904030114 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=5900 definitions=9216 signatures=668685 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1810050000 definitions=main-1904030115 Sender: linux-nfs-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org This proposal does look like it would be helpful.   How does this kind of proposal play out in terms of actually seeing the light of day in deployed systems? -Bradley On 4/2/19 10:07 PM, bfields@fieldses.org wrote: > On Wed, Apr 03, 2019 at 02:02:54AM +0000, Trond Myklebust wrote: >> The create itself needs to be sync, but the attribute delegations mean >> that the client, not the server, is authoritative for the timestamps. >> So the client now owns the atime and mtime, and just sets them as part >> of the (asynchronous) delegreturn some time after you are done writing. >> >> Were you perhaps thinking about this earlier proposal? >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dmyklebust-2Dnfsv4-2Dunstable-2Dfile-2Dcreation-2D01&d=DwIBAg&c=RoP1YumCXCgaWHvlZYR8PZh8Bv7qIrMUB65eapI_JnE&r=YIKOmJLMLfe5wQR3VJI7jGjCnepZlMwumApzvaKItrY&m=qlAJ6dZPGjbcTzNIpkTyk-RTii6lWw1CLIjF6jp3P2Y&s=aTTFNJlRH-dXrQmE4cSYEUd8Kv3ij5cqTJtvgIixMa8&e= > That's it, thanks! > > Bradley is concerned about performance of something like untar on a > backend filesystem with particularly high-latency metadata operations, > so something like your unstable file createion proposal (or actual write > delegations) seems like it should help. > > --b.