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[139.178.88.99]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id y16-20020a634b10000000b005cd8fa82040si2142049pga.614.2024.01.11.17.25.54 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 11 Jan 2024 17:25:54 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of linux-nfs+bounces-1051-linux.lists.archive=gmail.com@vger.kernel.org designates 139.178.88.99 as permitted sender) client-ip=139.178.88.99; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@kernel.org header.s=k20201202 header.b=MQQ2RNaL; spf=pass (google.com: domain of linux-nfs+bounces-1051-linux.lists.archive=gmail.com@vger.kernel.org designates 139.178.88.99 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="linux-nfs+bounces-1051-linux.lists.archive=gmail.com@vger.kernel.org"; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=kernel.org Received: from smtp.subspace.kernel.org (wormhole.subspace.kernel.org [52.25.139.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by sv.mirrors.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 378B9281C18 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 01:25:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C2CD4A10; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 01:24:59 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b="MQQ2RNaL" X-Original-To: linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org Received: from smtp.kernel.org (aws-us-west-2-korg-mail-1.web.codeaurora.org [10.30.226.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5BBA4A13 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 01:24:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1E001C433C7; Fri, 12 Jan 2024 01:24:58 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kernel.org; s=k20201202; t=1705022698; bh=woCbhz3aT/ll+Lk4DFpcUdJi6z9QT/AZdG3Q0nm7uOc=; h=Subject:From:To:Cc:Date:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=MQQ2RNaLekc0dtWhnEk5BH5Pwj3CBY8d1Eo/qw2TACUr1+Urd72oKJfj3kgF5nBTX n+69DWtGiCo4nLpmjlv/6yXsC32go+nCk9sBBK5F7yu7bWwfStPJx2F01x0wKRrmdD HKlbRHwpw094Jss0EZEN7F2YLhYMgiVJM1kF0d0mGbNa2sEB6p6R67H21GpIxmmt0d pc7aLQoEQqfn5YMzB1wux25zG2YLzKxgFZVW7pSY3VzgWAjjww2n1RI2Qh3RXtEyKP /7NRIRLLFhmGSQLnbjKSz54V0slkCr7sZHSxbDEqD3PyLrzvDcCoey2eTjHuawTcep /ouAsnouSqW8Q== Message-ID: <6065a76f32face0fa5cf84a238bcb1f2eebec7b5.camel@kernel.org> Subject: Re: NFSv4.1 mandatory locks working in Linux nfsd ? From: Jeff Layton To: Dan Shelton Cc: Roland Mainz , Linux NFS Mailing List Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2024 20:24:57 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: <39adc7fc114c6f8ea38fe7c846c322dab5fac907.camel@kernel.org> <5057fdb94f4d61661f9d13ccadb775a3a5bcdc92.camel@kernel.org> Autocrypt: addr=jlayton@kernel.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; 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 kZWuOsJdJQdmwlWC5L5ln9xgfr/4mOY38B0U= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Evolution 3.50.2 (3.50.2-1.fc39) Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 On Fri, 2024-01-12 at 01:44 +0100, Dan Shelton wrote: > On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 at 23:53, Jeff Layton wrote: > >=20 > > On Thu, 2024-01-11 at 22:27 +0100, Roland Mainz wrote: > > > On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 4:55=E2=80=AFPM Jeff Layton wrote: > > > > On Thu, 2024-01-11 at 10:54 -0500, Jeff Layton wrote: > > > > > On Sun, 2023-12-24 at 18:29 +0100, Roland Mainz wrote: > > > > > > Are there any known issues with NFSv4.1 mandatory locking nfsd = code in > > > > > > the Linux 5.10.0-22-rt-amd64 kernel (technically the Debian Bul= lseye > > > > > > RT kernel) ? Is there any kernel or NFS test suite module which= covers > > > > > > NFSv4.1 client mandatory locking ? > > > > >=20 > > > > > Linux doesn't support mandatory locking at all since 2021 [1]. Th= e Linux > > > > > NFS client and server therefore do not support v4.1 mandatory loc= king. > > > >=20 > > > > Forgot the footnote! > > > >=20 > > > > [1]: https://patchwork.kernel.org/project/linux-fsdevel/patch/20210= 820114046.69282-1-jlayton@kernel.org/ > > >=20 > > > OK, this is pretty bad in terms of interoperability.... ;-( > > >=20 > > > What should a Windows NFSv4 client (Hummingbird, OpenText, Exceed, > > > ms-nfs41-client, ...) do in this case ? > > > It basically means that locking for these clients will fail if the > > > server does not support it... ;-( > > >=20 > >=20 > > I think they have two choices: > >=20 > > Learn to deal with advisory locking, or contribute some sort of (sane) > > mandatory locking implementation to the Linux kernel. >=20 > None of this will happen. > 1. Advisory locking cannot be mapped to Windows mandatory locking. End > of story. They are incompatible. That is why the NFSv4 protocol had > mandatory locking built in into the first place. That was the grand > design and the grand dream. That is gone. Yep, pretty much. Samba does set VFS-layer advisory locks that (mostly) correspond to the locks that SMB clients set, but it's really just a best-effort sort of thing. It has to emulate the windows semantics internally. > 2. No one is going to implement a giant set of code just so that SAMBA > and NFSv4 can work. SAMBA has a builtin emulation so mandatory locking > works between Windows clients, ignoring the Linux side and Linux > advisory locking completely. >=20 Also, pretty much. With a general purpose OS like Linux, we try to avoid this sort of emulation. We do have that for the share/deny locking that happens during OPEN, but there was really no choice there since we couldn't reasonably implement that in the VFS, and it was a required part of the NFSv4 protocol. Mandatory locking is optional so we can just opt-out. > The only option is option three: NFSv4 for Windows will become a 3rd > class glorified FTP replacement with no functional locking. Just for > copying files around. End of story. >=20 More or less. FWIW, here's the LWN article from when we decided to start getting rid of mandatory locking in Linux: https://lwn.net/Articles/667210/ No one used it. It was racy and there weren't great ways to fix that that didn't slow down I/O.=20 --=20 Jeff Layton