In preparation for the flood of testers as we approach 2.6pre,
I thought I'd give this doc another airing to be sure that it
isn't missing anything important.. (Plus I've been meaning to
post an update for a while, and 42 sounded like a good number).
Dave
The post-halloween document. v0.42
(aka, 2.5 - what to expect)
Dave Jones <[email protected]>
(Updated as of 2.5.75)
This document explains some of the new functionality to be found in the 2.5
Linux kernel, some pitfalls you may encounter, and also points out some new
features which could really use testing.
Note, that "contact [email protected]" below also implies that you should also
cc: [email protected].
Latest version of this document can always be found at
http://www.codemonkey.org.uk/post-halloween-2.5.txt
Thanks to many [far too many to list] people for valuable feedback.
Note, that this document is somewhat x86-centric, but most features
documented here affect all platforms anyway.
Spanish translation at:
http://www.terra.es/personal/diegocg/post-halloween-2.5.es.txt
Applying patches.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- In 2.4 and previous kernels, the recommended way to apply patches was
to use a command line such as ...
gzip -cd patchXX.gz | patch -p0
In 2.5, Linus started adding an extra path element to the diffs,
so using -p1 in the untarred 'to be patched' directory is necessary.
Known gotchas.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Certain known bugs are being reported over and over. Here are the
workarounds.
- Blank screen after decompressing kernel?
Make sure your .config has
CONFIG_INPUT=y, CONFIG_VT=y, CONFIG_VGA_CONSOLE=y and CONFIG_VT_CONSOLE=y
A lot of people have discovered that taking their .config from 2.4 and
running make oldconfig to pick up new options leads to problems, notably
with CONFIG_VT not being set.
- An additional bug biting some people is that NICs fail to receive packets
(usually notable by a NIC not getting a DHCP lease for eg, despite being
sent one by the server). Booting with "noapic" "acpi=off" or a combination
of both fixes this for most people. Additional breakage reports should go
to Jeff Garzik <[email protected]>
- (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
boot with 'noapic'.
- Can't load any modules? You need updated tools (See modules section below).
Regressions.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
(Things not expected to work just yet)
- The hptraid/promise RAID drivers are currently non functional, and
will probably be converted to use device-mapper.
- Some filesystems still need work (Intermezzo, UFS, HFS, HPFS..)
- A number of drivers don't compile currently due to them needing various
work to convert them to the new APIs
- UMSDOS fs is currently missing, pending rewrite.
- The format of /proc/stat changed, which could break some
applications that still depend on the old layout.
Currently the only known application to break is the java
'DOTS' app. (http://bugme.osdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=277)
- Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
This is a known bug of rpm.
Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
Deprecated features.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- khttpd is gone.
- Older Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) support (For XFree86 4.0)
has been removed. Upgrade to XFree86 4.1.0 or higher.
- LVM1 has been removed. See Device-mapper below.
- boot time root= parsing changed.
ramdisks are now ram<n> instead of rd<n> and cm206 is cm206cd (instead of
cm206).
- The system call table is no longer exported. Any module that relied
on this previously will no longer work.
- Soundmodem hamradio support has been removed. Its functionality
has been superceded by a userspace replacement.
http://www.baycom.org/~tom/ham/soundmodem
- Direct booting from floppy is no longer supported.
You should now use a boot loader program instead.
- Callout tty devices (/dev/cua) have been deprecated since 2.1.90pre2.
Support is now removed.
Modules.
~~~~~~~~
- The in-kernel module loader got reimplemented.
- You need replacement module utilities from
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/rusty/modules/
- A backwards compatible set of module utilities is also available
from the same URL in RPM format.
- Debian sid users can 'apt-get install module-init-tools'
- Modules now free stuff marked with __init or __initdata.
- For Red Hat users, there's another pitfall in "/etc/rc.sysinit".
During startup, the script sets up the binary used to dynamically load
modules stored at "/proc/sys/kernel/modprobe". The initscript looks
for "/proc/ksyms", but since it doesn't exist in 2.5 kernels, the
binary used is "/sbin/true" instead.
This, eventually, will keep modules from working. Red Hat users will
have to patch the "/etc/rc.sysinit" script to set
"/proc/sys/kernel/modprobe" to "/sbin/modprobe", even
when "/proc/ksyms" doesn't exist.
Kernel build system.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- The build system is much improved compared to 2.4.
You should notice quicker builds, and less spontaneous rebuilds
of files on subsequent builds from already built trees.
- There are new graphical config tools.
"make xconfig" now requires the qt libraries.
"make gconfig" uses gtk libraries.
- Make menuconfig/oldconfig has no user-visible changes other than speed,
whilst numerous improvements have been made.
- Several new debug targets exist: 'allyesconfig' 'allnoconfig' 'allmodconfig'.
- Note: The new configuration system is not CML2 related.
- Also note: Whilst some ideas were taken from it, Keith Owens'
kbuild-2.5 project was not integrated.
- "make" is now the preferred command, without a target; it does <arch-zimage>
and modules.
- "make -jN" is now the preferred parallel-make execution.
Do not bother to provide "MAKE=xxx"
- The build is now much less verbose. If you want to see exactly what's
going on, try "make V=1" or set KBUILD_VERBOSE=1 in your environment.
- 'make kernel/mm.o' will build the named file, provided a
corresponding source exists. This also works for (non-composite)
modules. (FIXME: broken for modules right now?)
- 'make kernel/' will compile all files in a subdirectory and below.
- There is no need to run 'make dep' at any stage.
- 'make help' provides a list of typical targets, including debugging targets.
IO subsystem.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- You should notice considerable throughput improvements over 2.4 due
to much reworking of the block and the memory management layers.
- Report any regressions in this area to Jens Axboe <[email protected]>
and Andrew Morton <[email protected]>.
- Several different IO elevators are available to match different types
of workload. You can select which one to use with elvtune.
- Assorted changes throughout the block layer meant various block
device drivers had a large scale cleanup whilst being updated to
newer APIs.
- The size and alignment of O_DIRECT file IO requests now matches that
of the device, not the filesystem. Typically this means that you
can perform O_DIRECT IO with 512-byte granularity rather than 4k.
But if you rely upon this, your application will not work on 2.4 kernels
and will not work on some devices.
Enormous block size support.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Thanks to work done by Peter Chubb, block devices can now access up to
16TB on 32-bit architectures, and up to 8EB on 64-bit architectures.
- To use the new BLKGETSZ64 ioctls, you'll need updated file-utils.
(Currently only jfsutils 1.0.20 has this change, patches for other
filesystems are still pending merging)
POSIX ACLs & Extended attributes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Userspace tools available at http://acl.bestbits.at
VM Changes.
~~~~~~~~~~~
- Version zero swap partitions are no longer supported (everything is
using v1 now anyway - rerun mkswap if in doubt).
Linux 2.0.x requires v0 swap space, Linux v2.1.117 and later
support v1. mkswap(8) can format swap space in either format.
- The actual 'reverse mappings' part of Rik van Riel's rmap vm was merged.
VM behaviour under certain loads should improve.
- VM misbehaviour should be reported to [email protected]
- The VM explicitly checks for sparse swapfiles, and aborts if one is found.
- /proc/sys/vm/swappiness defines the kernel's preference for pagecache over
mapped memory. Setting it to 100 (percent) makes it treat both types of
memory equally. Setting it to zero makes the kernel very much prefer to
reclaim plain pagecache rather than mapped-into-pagetables memory.
- The bdflush() syscall is now officially deprecated. The syscall
does nothing, and prints a stern warning to users. The functionality
is replaced by the pdflush daemons.
- Due to various changes, swap files should be just as fast as swap partitions.
Kernel preemption.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- The much talked about preemption patches made it into 2.5.
With this included you should notice much lower latencies especially
in demanding multimedia applications.
- Note, there are still cases where preemption must be temporarily disabled
where we do not. These areas occur in places where per-CPU data is used.
- If you get "xxx exited with preempt count=n" messages in syslog,
don't panic, these are non fatal, but are somewhat unclean.
(Something is taking a lock, and exiting without unlocking)
- If you DO notice high latency with kernel preemption enabled in
a specific code path, please report that to Andrew Morton <[email protected]>
and Robert Love <[email protected]>.
The report should be something like "the latency in my xyz application
hits xxx ms when I do foo but is normally yyy" where foo is an action
like "unlink a huge directory tree".
Process scheduler improvements.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Another much talked about feature. Ingo Molnar reworked the process
scheduler to use an O(1) algorithm. In operation, you should notice
no changes with low loads, and increased scalability with large numbers
of processes, especially on large SMP systems.
- Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
- Robert Love wrote various utilities for changing behaviour of the
scheduler (binding processes to CPUs etc). You can find these tools at
http://tech9.net/rml/schedutils
- The behavior of sched_yield() changed a lot. A task that uses
this system call should now expect to sleep for possibly a very
long time. Tasks that do not really desire to give up the
processor for a while should probably not make heavy use of this
function. Unfortunately, some GUI programs (like Open Office)
do make excessive use of this call and under load their
performance is poor. It seems this new 2.5 behavior is optimal
but some user-space applications may need fixing.
- The above applies to use of yield() in the kernel, too.
- 2.5 adds system calls for manipulating a task's processor
affinity: sched_getaffinity() and sched_setaffinity()
- Regressions to [email protected] and [email protected]
- Debian users who encounter effects such as skips in mp3
playback, jerky mouse movement may want to stop the
X server from renicing itself to -10
You can alter this permanently with 'dpkg-reconfigure xserver-common';
if you elect not to have /etc/X11/Xwrapper.config managed by debconf,
simply edit it directly.
- Balancing of IRQs between multiple CPUs should be handled using the
irqbalance (http://people.redhat.com/arjanv/irqbalance/) program.
- David Mosberger maintains a webpage containing some current 'known gotchas'
of the O(1) scheduler at http://www.hpl.hp.com/research/linux/kernel/o1.php
PCI.
~~~~
- PCI domain support has been added. For most people, this just means that
all PCI slot names are extended with "0000:" on the front, but for people
with bigger servers it means they're able to access all their PCI devices.
- More hotplug drivers have been added, including a fake PCI hotplug driver
so people without specialised hardware can test hotplug features.
Fast userspace mutexes (Futexes).
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Rusty Russell added functionality that allows userspace to have
fast mutexes that only use syscalls when there is contention. Used by
NPTL.
- Bert Hubert has written some documentation on this functionality
at http://ds9a.nl/futex-manpages
epoll
~~~~~
Davide Libenzi wrote an event based poll replacement that got
included in 2.5. More info available at
http://www.xmailserver.org/linux-patches/nio-improve.html
http://lwn.net/Articles/13587/
Threading improvements.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Ingo Molnar put a lot of work into threading improvements during 2.5.
Some of the features of this work are:
- Generic pid allocator (arbitrary number of PIDs with no slowdown,
unified pidhash).
- Thread Local Storage syscalls
- sys_clone() enhancements (CLONE_SETTLS, CLONE_PARENT_SETTID, CLONE_SETTID,
CLONE_CLEARTID, CLONE_DETACHED)
- POSIX thread signals stuff (atomic signals, shared signals, etc.)
- Per-CPU GDT
- Threaded coredumping support
- sys_exit() speedups (O(1) exit)
- Generic, improved futexes, vcache
- New, threading related ptrace features
- exit/fork task cache
- /proc updates for threading
- API changes for threading.
- Users should notice a significant speedup in basic thread operations.
This is true to a lesser extent even for old-threading userspace libraries
such as LinuxThreads.
- Regressions should go to Ingo Molnar <[email protected]> and
[email protected]. Regressions could happen in the area of signal
handling and related threading semantics, plus coredumping.
- Native Posix Threading Library (NPTL).
Ulrich Drepper worked closely with Ingo on the threading enhancements, and
developed a 1:1 model threading library. You can find out more about NPTL at
http://people.redhat.com/drepper/nptl-design.pdf
Enhanced coredumping.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- 2.5 offers you the ability to configure the way core files are
named through a /proc/sys/kernel/core_pattern file.
You can use various format identifiers in this name to affect
how the core dump is named.
%p - insert pid into filename
%u - insert current uid into filename
%g - insert current gid into filename
%s - insert signal that caused the coredump into the filename
%t - insert UNIX time that the coredump occurred into filename
%h - insert hostname where the coredump happened into filename
%e - insert coredumping executable name into filename
You should ensure that the string does not exceed 64 bytes.
- Multithreaded processes can now dump core
Input layer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Possibly the most visible change to the end user. If misconfigured,
you'll find that your keyboard/mouse/other input device will no longer work.
2.5 offers a much more flexible interface to devices such as keyboards.
- The downside is more confusing options.
In the "Input device support" menu, be sure to enable at least the following.
--- Input I/O drivers
< > Serial i/o support
< > i8042 PC Keyboard controller
[ ] Keyboards
[ ] Mice
(Also choose the relevant keyboard/mouse from the list)
- If you find your keyboard/mouse still don't work, edit the file
drivers/input/serio/i8042.c, and replace the #undef DEBUG
with a #define DEBUG
When you boot, you should now see a lot more debugging information.
Forward this information to Vojtech Pavlik <[email protected]>
- If you use a KVM switcher, and experience problems, booting with the boot
time argument 'psmouse_noext' should fix your problems.
- Users of multimedia keys without X will see changes in how the kernel
handles those keys. People who customize keymaps or keycodes in 2.4
may need to make some changes in 2.5
PnP layer.
~~~~~~~~~~
- Support for plug and play devices such as early ISAPnP cards has improved a
lot in the 2.5 kernel. The new code behaves more closely to the code
handling PCI devices (probe, remove etc callbacks), and also merges
PnP BIOS access code.
- Report any regressions in plug & play functionality to
Adam Belay <[email protected]>
ALSA.
~~~~~
- The advanced linux sound architecture got merged into 2.5.
This offers considerably improved functionality over the older OSS drivers,
but requires new userspace tools.
- Several distros have shipped ALSA for some time, so you may already have the
necessary tools. If not, you can find them at http://www.alsa-project.org/
- ALSA can emulate OSS interface using the snd_pcm_oss/snd_pcm_mixer
modules, if your card produces nothing but silence, you may need to run
alsamixer to unmute channels wich /dev/mixer doesn't see
- Note that the OSS drivers are also still functional, and still present.
Many features/fixes that went into 2.4 are still not applied to these
drivers, and it's still unclear if they will remain when 2.6/3.0 ships.
The long term goal is to get everyone moved over to (the superior) ALSA.
AGP.
~~~~
- The agpgart driver got a long overdue cleanup which involved
splitting it into an agpgart core, and per-chipset drivers.
You may need to adjust your modules configuration to autoload
the chipset drivers on loading the agpgart module.
- Generic AGP 3.0 support is now included.
Faster system calls.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Systems that support the SYSENTER extension (Basically Intel PPro and
above, and AMD Athlons) now have a faster method of making the transition
from userspace to kernelspace when a syscall is performed.
- Without an updated glibc, this will not be noticable.
- VMWare 4 users may get crashes due to this.
Zwane Mwaikambo wrote a patch for a "nosysenter" option which is worth
googling for if there isn't a vmware update available.
- Regressions to [email protected] and [email protected]
procps.
~~~~~~~
- The 2.5 /proc filesystems changed some statistics, which confuse older
versions of procps. Rik van Riel and Robert Love have been maintaining a
version of procps during the 2.5 cycle which tracks changes to /proc which
you can find at http://tech9.net/rml/procps/
- Alternatively, the procps by Albert Cahalan now supports the altered formats
since v3.0.5 -- http://procps.sf.net/
- The /proc/meminfo format changed slightly which also broke gtop in strange
ways. Likely this also broke some of the KDE/GNOME panel applets.
Framebuffer layer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- James Simmons has reworked the framebuffer/console layer considerably during
2.5. Support for some cards is still lagging a little, but it should be
functionally no different than previous incarnations.
- boot time arguments may have changed depending on your driver.
an example of the change is..
append = "video=radeon:1024x768-24@100"
needs to become..
append = "video=radeonfb:1024x768-24@100"
- Current userspace tools (fbset for eg) are not yet updated,
and won't function as expected.
- The VESA framebuffer now enables MTRRs for the framebuffer memory range during
initialisation (Note: PCI cards only).
If you notice screen corruption, please report this, along with an lspci output,
so your card can be blacklisted.
- Any problems should go to <[email protected]>
IDE.
~~~~
- The IDE code rewrite was subject to much criticism in early 2.5.x, which
put off a lot of people from testing. This work was then subsequently
dropped, and reverted back to a 2.4.18 IDE status.
Since then additional work has occurred, but not to the extent
of the first cleanup attempts.
- Known problems with the current IDE code.
o Simplex IDE devices (eg Ali15x3) are missing DMA sometimes
o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
o Most PCMCIA devices have unload races and may oops on eject
o Modular IDE does not yet work, modular IDE PCI modules sometimes
oops on loading
o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
- IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
from the drive, and start over.
IDE TCQ.
~~~~~~~~
- Tagged command queueing for IDE devices has been included.
- Not all combinations of controllers & devices may like this,
so handle with care.
READ AS: ** Don't use IDE TCQ on any data you value.
It's likely bad combinations will be blacklisted as and when discovered.
- If you didn't choose the "TCQ on by default" option, you can enable
it by using the command
echo "using_tcq:32" > /proc/ide/hdX/settings
(replacing 32 with 0 disables TCQ again).
- Report success/failure stories to Jens Axboe <[email protected]> with
inclusion of hdparm -i /dev/hdX, and lspci output.
SCSI.
~~~~~
- Various SCSI drivers still need work, and don't even compile.
- Various drivers currently lack error handling.
These drivers will cause warnings during compilation due to
missing abort: & reset: functions.
- Note, that some drivers have had these members removed, but still
lack error handling. Those noticed so far are ncr53c8xxx, sym53c8xx and
inia100
- large dev_t support allowing thousands of disks to be
supported (was 128 or 256 in the 2.4 series)
- major code cleanup, initially to support the block layer (bio)
improvements have led to:
- better throughput (?) [less double handling of data]
- per HBA locks (there was a single io_request_lock in
the 2.4 series)
- more flexible interface to HBA drivers
- better hotplug support, especially for USB mass storage
and ieee1394 sbp2 devices [well it's work_in_progress]
- improved error processing and scanning code (support for
large, sparse lun spaces)
- lots of scsi driver "innards" available via sysfs
v4l2.
~~~~~
- The video4linux API finally got its long awaited cleanup.
- xawtv, bttv and most other existing v4l tools are also compatible
with the new v4l2 layer. You should notice no loss in functionality.
- See http://bytesex.org/v4l/ for more information.
Quota reworking.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The new quota system needs new tools. Supports 32 bit uids.
http://www.sf.net/projects/linuxquota/
CD Recording.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Jens Axboe added the ability to use DMA for writing CDs on
ATAPI devices. Writing CDs should be much faster than it
was in 2.4, and also less prone to buffer underruns and the like.
- Updated cdrecord in rpm and tar.gz can be found at
*.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/axboe/tools/
- With the above tools, you also no longer need ide-scsi in order to use
an IDE CD writer.
- Ripping audio tracks off of CDs now also uses DMA and should be
notably faster. You can also find an updated cdda2wav at the same location.
- Send good/bad reports of audio extraction with cdda2wav and burning with
the modified cdrecord to Jens Axboe <[email protected]>
- Currently only 'open by device name' works in cdrecord.
cdrecord -dev=/dev/hdX -inq
- More info at http://lwn.net/Articles/13538/ & http://lwn.net/Articles/13160/
USB:
~~~~
- Very little user visible changes, the only noticable 'major' change
is that there is now only one UHCI driver. As noted elsewhere, usbdevfs
got renamed to usbfs.
Nanosecond stat:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The stat64() syscall got changed to return jiffies granularity.
This allows make(1) to make better decisions on whether or not it
needs to recompile a file. Not all filesystems may support such precision.
Filesystems:
~~~~~~~~~~~~
A number of additional filesystems have made their way into 2.5.
Whilst these have had testing out of tree, the level of testing
after merging is unparalleled. Be wary of trusting data to immature
filesystems. A number of new features and improvements have also
been made to the existing filesystems from 2.4.
Reports of stress testing with the various tools available would
be beneficial.
Generic VFS changes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Since Linux 2.5.1 it is possible to atomically move a subtree to
another place. The call is...
mount --move olddir newdir
- Since 2.5.43, dmask=value sets the umask applied to directories only.
The default is the umask of the current process.
The fmask=value sets the umask applied to regular files only.
Again, the default is the umask of the current process.
devfs.
~~~~~~
- devfs got somewhat stripped down and a lot of duplicate functionality
got removed. You now need to enable CONFIG_DEVPTS_FS=y and mount
the devpts filesystem in the same manner you would if you were not
using devfs.
EXT2.
~~~~~
- 2.5.49 included an extension to ext2 which will cause it to not attach
buffer_head structures to file or directory pagecache at all, ever.
This is for the big highmem machines. It is enabled via the `-o nobh'
mount option.
- The ext2 filesystem is now using finer-grained locking which yields reduced
context switch rates and higher throughput on large SMP machines.
EXT3.
~~~~~
- The ext3 filesystem has gained indexed directory support, which offers
considerable performance gains when used on filesystems with directories
containing large numbers of files.
- In order to use the htree feature, you need at least version 1.32 of
e2fsprogs.
- Existing filesystems can be converted using the command
tune2fs -O dir_index /dev/hdXXX
- The latest e2fsprogs can be found at
http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/e2fsprogs
- data=journal mode is currently broken.
- The ext2 and ext3 filesystems have new file allocations policies (the "Orlov
allocator") which will place subdirectories closer together on-disk. This
tends to mean that operations which touch many files in a directory tree are
much faster if that tree was created under a 2.5 kernel.
Reiserfs.
~~~~~~~~~
- Reiserfs now supports inode attributes such as immutable.
NFS.
~~~~
- Basic support has been added for NFSv4 (server and client)
- Additionally, kNFSD now supports transport over TCP.
This experimental feature is also backported to 2.4.20
- Interoperability reports with other OS's would be useful.
- v1.0.3 of nfs-utils supports the newer 2.5 kernels change
of kdev_t type. You can grab it at http://nfs.sourceforge.net
- Problems to [email protected]
NTFS.
~~~~~
- A new, rewritten NTFS driver got merged during 2.5. It has the
following main benefits over the old driver:
- SMP and reentrant safe
- support bigger than 4 kB cluster sizes
- full support for sparse files on W2K/XP/W2K3
- mmap() support
- More stable, and much faster than the previous NTFS driver.
- Still read-only, but with safe file overwrite support without changes
to the file size
- More information is available at http://linux-ntfs.sf.net
sysfs.
~~~~~~
In simple terms, the sysfs filesystem is a saner way for
drivers to export their innards than /proc.
This filesystem is always compiled in, and can be mounted
just like another virtual filesystem. No userspace tools
beyond cat and echo are needed.
mount -t sysfs none /sys
See Documentation/filesystems/sysfs.txt for more info.
JFS.
~~~~
IBM's JFS got merged during 2.5. (And backported to 2.4.20, but
it was still a new feature here first. You can read more about JFS at
http://www-124.ibm.com/developerworks/oss/jfs/index.html
XFS.
~~~~
The SGI XFS filesystem has been merged, and has a number of userspace
features. Users are encouraged to read http://oss.sgi.com/projects/xfs
for more information.
The various utilities for creating and manipulating XFS volumes can
be found on SGI's ftp server:
ftp://oss.sgi.com/projects/xfs/download/download/cmd_tars/xfsprogs-2.3.9.src.tar.gz
CIFS.
~~~~~
Support utilities and documentation for the common internet file system (CIFS)
can be found at http://us1.samba.org/samba/Linux_CIFS_client.html
FAT.
~~~~
CVF (Compressed VFAT) support has been removed. This means you
will no longer be able to access DriveSpace partitions.
HugeTLBfs.
~~~~~~~~~~
Files in this filesystem are backed by large pages if the CPU
supports them. See Documentation/vm/hugetlbpage.txt for more details.
Internal filesystems.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
/proc/filesystems will contain several filesystems that are not
mountable in userspace, but are used internally by the kernel
to keep track of things. Amongst these filesystems are futexfs
and eventpollfs
Oprofile.
~~~~~~~~~
A system wide performance profiler has been included in 2.5.
With this option compiled in, you'll get an oprofilefs filesystem
which you can mount, that the userspace utilities talk to.
You can find out more at http://oprofile.sourceforge.net/oprofile-2.5.html
util-linux.
~~~~~~~~~~~
- You need a fixed readprofile utility for 2.5. Present in util-linux as
of 2.11z
Improved BIOS table support.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Linux now supports various new BIOS extensions.
Simple boot flag support.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The SBF specification is an x86 BIOS extension that allows improved
system boot speeds. It does this by marking a CMOS field to say
"I booted okay, skip extensive POST next reboot".
Userspace tool is at http://www.codemonkey.org.uk/cruft/sbf.c
More info on SBF is at http://www.microsoft.com/hwdev/resources/specs/simp_bios.asp
EDD Support.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Support for BIOS Enhanced Disk Drive Services (EDD) was added,
which exports information on what the BIOS thinks is the boot
drive and other useful info to /sys/firmware/edd
- Matt Domsch is interested in hearing success/fails on this code
with some simple tests decribed at http://domsch.com/linux/edd30/results.html
Intel IPMI support.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- IPMI is a standard for monitoring the hardware in a system.
- Project home page: http://openipmi.sourceforge.net
- Specification: http://www.intel.com/design/servers/ipmi/spec.htm
x86 CPU detection.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- The CPU detection code got a pretty hefty shake up. To be certain your
CPU has all relevant workarounds applied, be sure to check that it was
detected correctly. cat /proc/cpuinfo will tell what the kernel thinks it is.
- Likewise, the x86 MTRR driver got a considerable makeover.
Check that XFree86 sets up MTRRs in the same way it did in 2.4
(Failures will get logged in /var/log/XFree86.log)
- Early PII Xeon processors and possibly other early PII processors
require microcode updates either from the BIOS or the microcode driver
to work around CPU bugs the O(1) scheduler exposes.
You can find the relevant microcode tools at
http://www.urbanmyth.org/microcode/
- Any regressions in both should go to [email protected] Cc: [email protected]
Extra tainting.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Running certain AMD processors in SMP boxes is out of spec, and will taint
the kernel with the 'S' flag. Running 2 Athlon XPs for example may seem to
work fine, but may also introduce difficult to pin down bugs.
In time it's likely this tainting will be extended to cover other out of
spec cases.
Additionally, the new modules interface will taint the kernel if you try
to 'force' a module to load with insmod -f.
Power management.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- 2.5 contains a more up to date snapshot of the ACPI driver. Should
you experience any problems booting, try booting with the argument
"acpi=off" to rule out any ACPI interaction. ACPI has a much more involved
role in bringing the system up in 2.5 than it did in 2.4
- The old "acpismp=force" boot option is now obsolete, and will be ignored
due to the old "mini ACPI" parser being removed.
- software suspend is still in development, and in need of more work.
It is unlikely to work as expected currently.
CPU frequency scaling.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Certain processors have the facility to scale their voltage/clockspeed.
2.5 introduces an interface to this feature, see Documentation/cpufreq
for more information. This functionality also covers features like
Intel's speedstep, and the Powernow! feature present in mobile AMD Athlons.
In addition to x86 variants, this framework also supports various ARM CPUs.
You can find a userspace daemon that monitors battery life and
adjusts accordingly at: http://www.staikos.net/~staikos/cpufreqd/
Background polling of MCE.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The machine check handler has been extended so that it regularly polls
for any problems on AMD Athlon, and Intel Pentium 4 systems.
This may result in machine check exceptions occuring more frequently
than they did in 2.4 on out of spec systems (Overclocking/inadequate
cooling/underated PSU etc..).
LVM2 - DeviceMapper.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The LVM1 code got removed wholesale, and replaced with a much better
designed 'device mapper'.
- This is backwards compatible with the LVM1 disk format.
- Device mapper does require new tools to manage volumes however.
You can get these from ftp://ftp.sistina.com/pub/LVM2/tools/
Debugging options.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
During the stabilising period, it's likely that the debugging options
in the kernel hacking menu will trigger quite a few problems.
Please report any of these problems to [email protected]
rather than just disabling the relevant CONFIG_ options.
Merging of kksymoops means that the kernel will now spit out
automatically decoded oopses (no more feeding them to ksymoops).
For this reason, you should always enable the option in the
kernel hacking menu labelled "Load all symbols for debugging/kksymoops".
Testing with CONFIG_PREEMPT will also increase the amount of debug
code that gets enabled in the kernel. Kernel preemption gives us
the ability to do a whole slew of debugging checks like sleeping
with locks held, scheduling while atomic, exiting with locks held, etc.
Compiler issues.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- The recommended compiler (for x86) is still 2.95.3.
- When compiled with a modern gcc (Ie gcc 3.x), 2.5 will use additional
optimisations that 2.4 didn't. This may shake out compiler bugs that
2.4 didn't expose.
- Do not use gcc 3.0.x on x86 due to a stack pointer handling bug.
- gcc 2.96 is not supported with CONFIG_FRAME_POINTER=y due to a stack
pointer handling bug.
- gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
Security concerns.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Several security issues solved in 2.4 may not yet be forward ported
to 2.5. For this reason 2.5.x kernels should not be tested on
untrusted systems. Testing known 2.4 exploits and reporting results
is useful.
Networking.
~~~~~~~~~~~
- ebtables
The bridging firewall code got merged. To manage these you'll
need the ebtables tool available from
http://users.pandora.be/bart.de.schuymer/ebtables/
More on bridge-nf can be found at http://bridge.sourceforge.net
- Bridged packets can now be 'seen' by iptables.
- IPSec
Linux finally has IPSec support in mainline. Use the KAME tools port on
ftp://ftp.inr.ac.ru/ip-routing/iputils-ss021109-try.tar.bz2
For more info see http://www.lib.uaa.alaska.edu/linux-kernel/archive/2002-Week-44/1127.html
Also Bert Hubert has a howto at http://lartc.org/howto/lartc.ipsec.html
Additionally, ipsec-utils is at http://sourceforge.net/projects/ipsec-tools
Herbert Xu also has patches against FreeSWAN 2.00 to allow its userspace
to use the 2.5 IPSec functionality. They can be downloaded from
http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/freeswan/
- Some applications may trigger the kernel to spit out warnings about
'process xxx using obsolete setsockopt SO_BSDCOMPAT' .
- Bind 9.2.2 checks for #ifdef SO_BSDCOMPAT in <asm/socket.h> correctly,
so a recompile is all that is needed.
- bind9-host from debian testing triggers, though the 'host' package doesn't.
- process `snmpd' is using obsolete setsockopt SO_BSDCOMPAT
- process `snmptrapd' is using obsolete setsockopt SO_BSDCOMPAT
- ntop uses obsolete (PF_INET,SOCK_PACKET)
- Users of boxes with >1 NIC may find that for eg, eth0 and eth1 refer to
the opposites of what they did in 2.4. This is a bug that will be fixed
before 2.6.0. One option (or management workaround) for this is to use
'nameif' to name Ethernet interfaces. There is a HOWTO for doing this at
<http://xenotime.net/linux/doc/network-interface-names.txt>
- Support for various new RFCs.
- RFC3173 (IP Payload Compression).
- Linux reaches congestion collapse when subjected to heavy network load.
NAPI fixes this amongst other things and therefore improving network
performance.
More info at http://www.cyberus.ca/~hadi/usenix-paper.tgz and
ftp://robur.slu.se/pub/Linux/net-development/NAPI/
Crypto
~~~~~~
- A generic crypto API has been merged, offering support for various
algorithms (HMAC,MD4,MD5,SHA-1,DES,Triple DES EDE, Blowfish)
- This functionality is used by IPSec and the crypto-loop. It's possible
that it will later also be available for use in userspace through a crypto
device, possibly compatible with the OpenBSD crypto userspace.
- The in-kernel loopback device can now do crypto using the CryptoAPI.
May need new userspace tools.
Deprecated.
~~~~~~~~~~~
- usbdevfs will be going away in 2.7. The same filesystem can
be mounted as 'usbfs' in recent 2.4 kernels, and in 2.5.52
and above, which is what the filesystem will furthermore be
known as.
- elvtune is deprecated (as are the ioctl's it used).
Instead, the io scheduler tunables are exported in sysfs (see below)
in the /sys/block/<device>/iosched directory.
Jens wrote a document explaining the tunables of the new scheduler at
http://www.lib.uaa.alaska.edu/linux-kernel/archive/2002-Week-44/att-deadline-iosched.txt
Ports.
~~~~~~
- 2.5 features support for several new architectures.
- x86-64 (AMD Hammer)
- ppc64
- UML (User mode Linux)
See http://user-mode-linux.sf.net for more information.
- uCLinux: m68k(w/o MMU), h8300 and v850. sh also added a uCLinux option.
- The 64 bit s390x port got collapsed into a single port, appearing
as a config option in the base s390 arch.
- In the opposite direction, arm26 was split out from arm.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Revision history:
0.42 - CONFIG_LOG_BUF_SHIFT is now sanity checked by Kconfig
Hyperthreading scheduler improvements.
ALSA OSS emulation.
32bit uids in new quota.
Not all filesystems support nanosecond stat.
Note that NTFS still isn't R/W
Mention CryptoLoop.
0.41 - V=0 is now default. Document V=1
s/Redhat/Red Hat/ everywhere.
Added vmware sysenter note.
MTRR for vesafb
Various grammar fixes.
Selectable elevators.
PCI domains
0.40 - Callout tty devices are removed.
Added note about modules in Red Hat 9
0.39 - irqbalance note added.
Added ntop, snmp tools obsolete messages.
Added link to David Mosberger's O(1) page.
Mention Herbert Xu's FreeSWAN patches.
Add CONFIG_VGA_CONSOLE to the list of gotchas.
Add note about 2.4 .config's to gotchas.
Reword devpts note.
0.38 - Fixed URL to nameif
0.37 - devfs users now need to mount devpts.
mention h8300 port.
mentioned NTFS rewrite.
0.36 - Include Doug Gilberts 'positive SCSI spin'.
Mention NAPI.
Reword the CPU bug workaround that the O(1) scheduler exposes.
Added 'Known Gotchas' section
0.35 - Note about KDE panel applets.
mount --move, dmask, fmask
Removed note about oprofile utilities being underdeveloped.
Mention ext2 locking, and ext2/ext3 orlov allocator.
0.34 - Remove people.redhat.com NPTL URLs on Ulrich Dreppers request.
Added note about s390x going away.
Various kbuild updates.
Note about swap files.
Added note about -p1 vs -p0
Lots of typo fixes from Randy Dunlap.
RPM from RH9 seems to have problems.
0.33 - Networking RFCs section added.
0.32 - Added Soundmodem userspace replacement URL.
0.31 - ext3 data=journal breakage noted.
0.30 - Athlon powernow is now supported.
0.29 - Mention NIC renumbering and ACPI/APIC NIC bugs.
0.28 - SO_BSDCOMPAT obsolete messages, nfsutils.
0.27 - radeon -> radeonfb
0.26 - Added info about readprofile.
0.25 - Added cdrecord example. Added URL to Spanish translation.
0.1->0.24 - Unrecorded history
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Other Links.
http://www.kernelnewbies.org/status/
http://bugzilla.kernel.org/
--
Dave Jones http://www.codemonkey.org.uk
On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> - An additional bug biting some people is that NICs fail to receive packets
> (usually notable by a NIC not getting a DHCP lease for eg, despite being
> sent one by the server). Booting with "noapic" "acpi=off" or a combination
> of both fixes this for most people. Additional breakage reports should go
> to Jeff Garzik <[email protected]>
For 3com that was fixed in 2.4-ac months ago. There is a mostly
undocmented power management bitflag that some bioses seem to know about
for ACPI
> - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
> boot with 'noapic'.
Does 2.5 not have the INTD routing fix yet ?
> - The hptraid/promise RAID drivers are currently non functional, and
> will probably be converted to use device-mapper.
> - Some filesystems still need work (Intermezzo, UFS, HFS, HPFS..)
The hfsplus file system is missing from 2.5 at the moment
> - Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
> This is a known bug of rpm.
> Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
> - Older Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) support (For XFree86 4.0)
> has been removed. Upgrade to XFree86 4.1.0 or higher.
The current 2.5 DRM doesnt seem to work with 4.1, but does with 4.3 at
least on my testing of i810. I need to double check the results unless
others see the same
> Modules.
> ~~~~~~~~
> - For Red Hat users, there's another pitfall in "/etc/rc.sysinit".
> During startup, the script sets up the binary used to dynamically load
> modules stored at "/proc/sys/kernel/modprobe". The initscript looks
> for "/proc/ksyms", but since it doesn't exist in 2.5 kernels, the
> binary used is "/sbin/true" instead.
Better to cite the explanation and fix in the FAQ/README for the new
module tools 8)
> Enhanced coredumping.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - 2.5 offers you the ability to configure the way core files are
> named through a /proc/sys/kernel/core_pattern file.
> You can use various format identifiers in this name to affect
> how the core dump is named.
So does 2.4 8)
2.4-ac also offers setuid core dump facilities I need to forward port
> - Multithreaded processes can now dump core
> IDE.
> ~~~~
> - Known problems with the current IDE code.
> o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
FIXED
> o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
Should be fixed in 2.5, fixed(ish) in 2.4
> o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
> - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> from the drive, and start over.
Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
> CD Recording.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - Jens Axboe added the ability to use DMA for writing CDs on
> ATAPI devices. Writing CDs should be much faster than it
> was in 2.4, and also less prone to buffer underruns and the like.
Currently generally crashes the machine on problems or if you have
anything touching the other channel
> - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
This URL appears wrong!
> to 2.5. For this reason 2.5.x kernels should not be tested on
> untrusted systems. Testing known 2.4 exploits and reporting results
> is useful.
There is at least one known local root exploit in 2.5.75
> Ports.
> ~~~~~~
> - 2.5 features support for several new architectures.
> - x86-64 (AMD Hammer)
> - ppc64
> - UML (User mode Linux)
> See http://user-mode-linux.sf.net for more information.
> - uCLinux: m68k(w/o MMU), h8300 and v850. sh also added a uCLinux option.
> - The 64 bit s390x port got collapsed into a single port, appearing
> as a config option in the base s390 arch.
> - In the opposite direction, arm26 was split out from arm.
sh64 ?
Hello!
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Reiserfs.
> ~~~~~~~~~
> - Reiserfs now supports inode attributes such as immutable.
This was included into 2.4.17, I think, so this is not exactly new feature.
On the real new features list we have:
- Relocated/nonstandard size journal support (actually was included in 2.4.22-pre3, too)
- Support for writes larger than 4k in size (get speedup on large file writes, esp. in append mode,
should be more SMP friendly, too)
- Variable blocksize support (i.e. you can choose any blocksize in range of 1024 .. PAGE_CACHE_SIZE, must be power of 2)
Bye,
Oleg
> > - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> > kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> > See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
>
> This URL appears wrong!
Nahh, that's just the same old annoying bkbits bug. Try with lynx...
--
Tomas Szepe <[email protected]>
On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 15:02:19 +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Deprecated features.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - khttpd is gone.
> - Older Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) support (For XFree86 4.0)
> has been removed. Upgrade to XFree86 4.1.0 or higher.
> - LVM1 has been removed. See Device-mapper below.
> - boot time root= parsing changed.
> ramdisks are now ram<n> instead of rd<n> and cm206 is cm206cd (instead of
> cm206).
> - The system call table is no longer exported. Any module that relied
> on this previously will no longer work.
> - Soundmodem hamradio support has been removed. Its functionality
> has been superceded by a userspace replacement.
> http://www.baycom.org/~tom/ham/soundmodem
> - Direct booting from floppy is no longer supported.
> You should now use a boot loader program instead.
> - Callout tty devices (/dev/cua) have been deprecated since 2.1.90pre2.
> Support is now removed.
These are not deprecated, they are gone. Deprecated means "in the process
of being phased out, but still usable".
-Paul Dickson
On 11 Jul 2003, Alan Cox wrote:
> On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
> > boot with 'noapic'.
>
> Does 2.5 not have the INTD routing fix yet ?
In 2.5.75.
> > - The hptraid/promise RAID drivers are currently non functional, and
> > will probably be converted to use device-mapper.
Please put software RAID here to avoid confusion.
> > IDE.
> > ~~~~
> > - Known problems with the current IDE code.
> > o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
> FIXED
> > o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
> Should be fixed in 2.5, fixed(ish) in 2.4
> > o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> > either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
> > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > from the drive, and start over.
>
> Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
"hdx=remap" and "hdx=remap63" boot options can be used.
Or can I remove them?
--
Bartlomiej
On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:46, Tomas Szepe wrote:
> > > - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> > > kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> > > See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
> >
> > This URL appears wrong!
>
> Nahh, that's just the same old annoying bkbits bug. Try with lynx...
I did - it references a changeset unrelayed to kmalloc
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Known gotchas.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Certain known bugs are being reported over and over. Here are the
> workarounds.
> - Blank screen after decompressing kernel?
> Make sure your .config has
> CONFIG_INPUT=y, CONFIG_VT=y, CONFIG_VGA_CONSOLE=y and CONFIG_VT_CONSOLE=y
> A lot of people have discovered that taking their .config from 2.4 and
> running make oldconfig to pick up new options leads to problems, notably
> with CONFIG_VT not being set.
You might want to mention the synaptics touchpad driver/event for
XFree86, as I'm sure that will be a FAQ amongst laptop users
http://w1.894.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/
Paul
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:26:19PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
> > - 2.5 features support for several new architectures.
> > - x86-64 (AMD Hammer)
> > - ppc64
> > - UML (User mode Linux)
> > See http://user-mode-linux.sf.net for more information.
> > - uCLinux: m68k(w/o MMU), h8300 and v850. sh also added a uCLinux option.
> > - The 64 bit s390x port got collapsed into a single port, appearing
> > as a config option in the base s390 arch.
> > - In the opposite direction, arm26 was split out from arm.
>
> sh64 ?
>
Not merged yet, I'm still doing a number of 2.5 fixups for it locally. It's
already been merged into 2.4 however.
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:00:33PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
> On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:46, Tomas Szepe wrote:
> > > > - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> > > > kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> > > > See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
> > >
> > > This URL appears wrong!
> >
> > Nahh, that's just the same old annoying bkbits bug. Try with lynx...
>
> I did - it references a changeset unrelayed to kmalloc
I know, sorry. The version numbers in BK are not stable, they can't be.
You have to use the underlying internal version number. If someone who
knows can show me the output of
bk changes -r<correct rev>
for that changeset I will figure out a way to have a URL that doesn't change
and send it to Dave for that doc as well as post it there.
--
---
Larry McVoy lm at bitmover.com http://www.bitmover.com/lm
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 09:11, Larry McVoy wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:00:33PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
> > On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:46, Tomas Szepe wrote:
> > > > > - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> > > > > kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> > > > > See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
> > > >
> > > > This URL appears wrong!
> > >
> > > Nahh, that's just the same old annoying bkbits bug. Try with lynx...
> >
> > I did - it references a changeset unrelayed to kmalloc
>
> I know, sorry. The version numbers in BK are not stable, they can't be.
> You have to use the underlying internal version number. If someone who
> knows can show me the output of
>
> bk changes -r<correct rev>
>
> for that changeset I will figure out a way to have a URL that doesn't change
> and send it to Dave for that doc as well as post it there.
This looks like the right one as currently numbered.
http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
Steven
On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Dave Jones wrote:
> Use the KAME tools port on
> ftp://ftp.inr.ac.ru/ip-routing/iputils-ss021109-try.tar.bz2
The above is deprecated for ipsec, use the ipsec-tools stuff mentioned
below.
> Additionally, ipsec-utils is at http://sourceforge.net/projects/ipsec-tools
- James
--
James Morris
<[email protected]>
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:26:19PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
> > - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
> > boot with 'noapic'.
>
> Does 2.5 not have the INTD routing fix yet ?
It does. It is in both 2.4 and 2.5 mainline now.
> > IDE.
> > ~~~~
> > - Known problems with the current IDE code.
> > o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
> FIXED
> > o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
> Should be fixed in 2.5, fixed(ish) in 2.4
> > o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> > either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
> > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > from the drive, and start over.
>
> Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
Definitely. I'm hoping that people will decide upon a userland that
supports the popular (non-raid) partition tables as well as the simple
raid partitions, too. Maybe that's a pipe dream, though ;-)
> > Ports.
> > ~~~~~~
> > - 2.5 features support for several new architectures.
> > - x86-64 (AMD Hammer)
> > - ppc64
> > - UML (User mode Linux)
> > See http://user-mode-linux.sf.net for more information.
> > - uCLinux: m68k(w/o MMU), h8300 and v850. sh also added a uCLinux option.
> > - The 64 bit s390x port got collapsed into a single port, appearing
> > as a config option in the base s390 arch.
> > - In the opposite direction, arm26 was split out from arm.
>
> sh64 ?
Only in 2.4.
Jeff
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Oprofile.
> ~~~~~~~~~
> A system wide performance profiler has been included in 2.5.
> With this option compiled in, you'll get an oprofilefs filesystem
> which you can mount, that the userspace utilities talk to.
> You can find out more at http://oprofile.sourceforge.net/oprofile-2.5.html
this link is not valid, use http://oprofile.sourceforge.net/ instead.
--
Regards,
Wiktor Wodecki
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:55:39PM +0200, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz wrote:
> > > - The hptraid/promise RAID drivers are currently non functional, and
> > > will probably be converted to use device-mapper.
>
> Please put software RAID here to avoid confusion.
That introduces confusion with dev/md, which is what people have
traditionally called software RAID, IMO...
I like arjan's "fakeraid" or "ataraid" names. ;-)
> > > IDE.
> > > ~~~~
> > > - Known problems with the current IDE code.
> > > o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
> > FIXED
> > > o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
> > Should be fixed in 2.5, fixed(ish) in 2.4
> > > o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> > > either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
> > > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > > from the drive, and start over.
> >
> > Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
>
> "hdx=remap" and "hdx=remap63" boot options can be used.
> Or can I remove them?
You can remove them... if there is a userspace component that handles
this. As much as I would love to do so, we can't just remove components
that DM _can_ handle ;-) ;-) If so, we could go ahead and remove MD
raid0 too, and such.
Jeff
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 16:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
> boot with 'noapic'.
On my system (with VIA KT266 chipset) I can't boot also using noapic
parameter, it freezes on "calibrating apic timer" using or not the
noapic parameter.
The only way is not enabling APIC at all.
--
Flameeyes <[email protected]>
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> USB:
> ~~~~
> - Very little user visible changes, the only noticable 'major' change
> is that there is now only one UHCI driver. As noted elsewhere, usbdevfs
> got renamed to usbfs.
We may want to mention here that usb-storage has changed behavior. A
device which is disconnected and then re-connected is not re-associated
with the old /dev/ node. Also some performance enhancements.
Matt
--
Matthew Dharm Home: [email protected]
Maintainer, Linux USB Mass Storage Driver
I see you've been reading alt.sex.chubby.sheep voraciously.
-- Tanya
User Friendly, 11/24/97
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 05:59:39PM +0200, Flameeyes wrote:
> On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 16:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
> > boot with 'noapic'.
> On my system (with VIA KT266 chipset) I can't boot also using noapic
> parameter, it freezes on "calibrating apic timer" using or not the
> noapic parameter.
> The only way is not enabling APIC at all.
More details, please.
Does 2.4.22-pre4 work for you?
Jeff
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Known gotchas.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Certain known bugs are being reported over and over. Here are the
> workarounds.
> - Blank screen after decompressing kernel?
> Make sure your .config has
> CONFIG_INPUT=y, CONFIG_VT=y, CONFIG_VGA_CONSOLE=y and CONFIG_VT_CONSOLE=y
> A lot of people have discovered that taking their .config from 2.4 and
> running make oldconfig to pick up new options leads to problems, notably
> with CONFIG_VT not being set.
/boot/config-$(uname -r) will be looked at before arch/$(ARCH)/defconfig
potentially leading to some of the above (i.e. CONFIG_FB=y
CONFIG_FB_CONSOLE (or so) unset) if you don't look at every menu /
submenu in menuconfig / xconfig, and even more awkward results if cross
compiling for another arch.
--
Tom Rini
http://gate.crashing.org/~trini/
On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:55:39PM +0200, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz wrote:
> > > > - The hptraid/promise RAID drivers are currently non functional, and
> > > > will probably be converted to use device-mapper.
> >
> > Please put software RAID here to avoid confusion.
>
> That introduces confusion with dev/md, which is what people have
> traditionally called software RAID, IMO...
s/software RAID/propertiary software RAIDs/
> I like arjan's "fakeraid" or "ataraid" names. ;-)
"fakeraid" sounds good. :-)
> > > > IDE.
> > > > ~~~~
> > > > - Known problems with the current IDE code.
> > > > o Serverworks OSB4 may panic on bad blocks or other non fatal errors
> > > FIXED
> > > > o PCMCIA IDE hangs on eject
> > > Should be fixed in 2.5, fixed(ish) in 2.4
> > > > o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> > > > either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
> > > > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > > > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > > > from the drive, and start over.
> > >
> > > Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
> >
> > "hdx=remap" and "hdx=remap63" boot options can be used.
> > Or can I remove them?
>
> You can remove them... if there is a userspace component that handles
> this. As much as I would love to do so, we can't just remove components
> that DM _can_ handle ;-) ;-) If so, we could go ahead and remove MD
> raid0 too, and such.
How userspace component can help if you have ie. On-Track DM
on your boot device?
I think you missed my point :-).
I think if somebody adds On-Track and EZ auto-detection to device mapper
I can safely remove these ide boot options...
--
Bartlomiej
> Jeff
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 06:23:32PM +0200, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz wrote:
> How userspace component can help if you have ie. On-Track DM
> on your boot device?
initrd (now) or initramfs (future).
I would love to move all partition table (this includes raid
superblocks) into userspace, and device mapper makes this possible.
> I think you missed my point :-).
>
> I think if somebody adds On-Track and EZ auto-detection to device mapper
> I can safely remove these ide boot options...
Agreed.
Jeff
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 11:58:43AM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> I like arjan's "fakeraid" or "ataraid" names. ;-)
I'd prefer fakeraid because this describes it best.
It's a software raid that wants to look like hardware raid to
(windows) users.
On Sat, Jul 12, 2003 at 01:43:15AM +1000, James Morris wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Dave Jones wrote:
>
> > Use the KAME tools port on
> > ftp://ftp.inr.ac.ru/ip-routing/iputils-ss021109-try.tar.bz2
>
> The above is deprecated for ipsec, use the ipsec-tools stuff mentioned
> below.
Or the OpenBSD isakpmd or Herbert's patched freeswan userland, or..
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 18:04, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> More details, please.
Ok, I think that a more specified chipset information could be useful:
00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133]
(rev 03)
00:01.0 PCI bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133 AGP]
I'll also attach my .config (the LOGO_NGE is my edit), the working
version, the not working version is setting to y X86_UP_APIC and
X86_UP_IOAPIC.
I tried both with or without noapic at the commandline.
I can't paste the console message because it didn't arrive to mount the
rootfs.
> Does 2.4.22-pre4 work for you?
I'm not using anymore the 2.4 series, but I've tried after your post.
I didn't applied the xfs patches (i have xfs rootfs), but since the 2.5
didn't arrive to mount it, I think that could be enough if it doesn't
freeze in the calibration.
2.4.22-pre4 arrives at the fs mount so it probably works.
--
Flameeyes <[email protected]>
On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 16:37, Steven Cole wrote:
> This looks like the right one as currently numbered.
>
> http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
Thanks. That doesn't make it clear if the bug means you get less
inline than expected or broken build ?
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 07:26, Alan Cox wrote:
> or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
> fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
I think the 2.5 problem is _only_ in rpm 4.2.
It looks like it is still in the latest version, too:
[10:32:41]root@phantasy:~# rpm -q rpm
rpm-4.2.1-0.11
[10:32:44]root@phantasy:~# rpm --rebuilddb
error: db4 error(16) from dbenv->remove: Device or resource busy
4.2 is fine, otherwise :)
Robert Love
On 11 Jul 2003 17:59:39 +0200, Flameeyes <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 16:02, Dave Jones wrote:
>> - (Possibly linked to above bug) VIA APIC routing is currently broken.
>> boot with 'noapic'.
>On my system (with VIA KT266 chipset) I can't boot also using noapic
>parameter, it freezes on "calibrating apic timer" using or not the
>noapic parameter.
>The only way is not enabling APIC at all.
Are you talking about UP_APIC or UP_IOAPIC?
Does UP_APIC with neither I/O-APIC nor ACPI work?
You could also try UP_IOAPIC but without ACPI.
/Mikael
Steven Cole wrote:
> On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 09:11, Larry McVoy wrote:
>
>>On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:00:33PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
>>
>>>On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:46, Tomas Szepe wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>- gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
>>>>>> kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
>>>>>> See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
>>>>>
>>>>>This URL appears wrong!
>>>>
>>>>Nahh, that's just the same old annoying bkbits bug. Try with lynx...
>>>
>>>I did - it references a changeset unrelayed to kmalloc
>>
>>I know, sorry. The version numbers in BK are not stable, they can't be.
>>You have to use the underlying internal version number. If someone who
>>knows can show me the output of
>>
>> bk changes -r<correct rev>
>>
>>for that changeset I will figure out a way to have a URL that doesn't change
>>and send it to Dave for that doc as well as post it there.
>
>
> This looks like the right one as currently numbered.
>
> http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
>
> Steven
There is no problem with the current version of this patch. I rewrote
the original patch to work around the bug in gcc. The bug is that:
if (size < X) return kmem_cache_alloc(...);
would not cause the remaining if statements to be marked as dead code, but:
if (size < X) goto found;
...
found: return kmem_cache_alloc(...);
does optimize properly.
--
Brian Gerst
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> Enormous block size support.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
How about "block device size" instead? This made me think of blocks larger
than page size initially (even though I know that hasn't happened).
> o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
Is this still true? I seem to recall testing a kernel in the 2.5.6x range,
and it worked. (haven't tested more recent kernels yet -- compiling one now
though)
> EXT3.
> ~~~~~
> - data=journal mode is currently broken.
Is this still true (or is that still in -mm?)
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 11:14:53AM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> > Enormous block size support.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> How about "block device size" instead? This made me think of blocks larger
> than page size initially (even though I know that hasn't happened).
Agreed.
> > o ide_scsi is completely broken in 2.5.x. Known problem. If you need it
> > either use 2.4 or fix it 8)
>
> Is this still true? I seem to recall testing a kernel in the 2.5.6x range,
> and it worked. (haven't tested more recent kernels yet -- compiling one now
> though)
IIRC Alan's comment was "this fixes 99% of it"
Jeff
On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Dave Jones wrote:
> - gcc 3.2.2-5 as shipped by Red Hat generates incorrect code in the
> kmalloc optimisation introduced in 2.5.71
> See http://linus.bkbits.net:8080/linux-2.5/[email protected]
IIRC this is a sub-optimal code generation more then a panic generator.
- Davide
On Friday 11 July 2003 09:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> Process scheduler improvements.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
> over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
I'm pretty sure this is not in 2.5 (unless it's in bk after 2.5.75)
-Andrew Theurer
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:37:12PM -0500, Andrew Theurer wrote:
> On Friday 11 July 2003 09:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > Process scheduler improvements.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > - Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
> > over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
>
> I'm pretty sure this is not in 2.5 (unless it's in bk after 2.5.75)
Wrong, grep for sibling.
Jeff
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:37:12PM -0500, Andrew Theurer wrote:
> On Friday 11 July 2003 09:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > Process scheduler improvements.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > - Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
> > over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
>
> I'm pretty sure this is not in 2.5 (unless it's in bk after 2.5.75)
>
wasn't this merged back in 2.4.6x?
> > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > from the drive, and start over.
>
> Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
Or to use boot parameters:
* "hdx=remap63" : add 63 to all sector numbers (for OnTrack DM)
* "hdx=remap" : remap 0->1 (for EZDrive)
(So, I think the language "no longer supported" is a bit strong.
Maybe "no longer autodetected".)
Andries
On Friday 11 July 2003 14:54, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:37:12PM -0500, Andrew Theurer wrote:
> > On Friday 11 July 2003 09:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > > Process scheduler improvements.
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > - Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
> > > over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
> >
> > I'm pretty sure this is not in 2.5 (unless it's in bk after 2.5.75)
>
> Wrong, grep for sibling.
I don't see sibling mentioned anywhere in the context of load balance, only in
smpboot.c. Where exactly do you see any HT awareness in load balance?
-Andrew Theurer
On Friday 11 July 2003 14:59, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:37:12PM -0500, Andrew Theurer wrote:
> > On Friday 11 July 2003 09:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > > Process scheduler improvements.
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > - Scheduler is now Hyperthreading SMP aware and will disperse processes
> > > over physically different CPUs, instead of just over logical CPUs.
> >
> > I'm pretty sure this is not in 2.5 (unless it's in bk after 2.5.75)
>
> wasn't this merged back in 2.4.6x?
I believe that was support of, not enhancement for HT. Actually there may
have been some enhancements in other areas, but not scheduler.
-Andrew Theurer
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 11:56:13AM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> Definitely. I'm hoping that people will decide upon a userland that
> supports the popular (non-raid) partition tables as well as the simple
> raid partitions, too.
That reminds me.
Our DOS-type partition tables are close to their limit -
regularly people complain about things that do not work
with disks of size between 1 TB and 2 TB, and if not today
then very soon we'll see disks too large to handle with
DOS-type partition tables.
Two years ago or so I wrote some simple-minded stuff -
maybe there also was discussion on Linux-type partition tables,
I forgot all about it.
(Maybe the format was plan9-inspired, with sequence number,
start, size, label and uuid, all in ASCII.)
What is the situation today? What is the structure of these
LVM or raid partition tables? Is there some natural type
suitable for crossing the 2 TB limit?
Is it better to invent a Linux-type partition table?
Andries
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:55:39PM +0200, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz wrote:
> > > - IDE disk geometry translators like OnTrack, EZ Partition, Disk Manager
> > > are no longer supported. The only way forward is to remove the translator
> > > from the drive, and start over.
> >
> > Or to use device mapper to remap the disk.
>
> "hdx=remap" and "hdx=remap63" boot options can be used.
> Or can I remove them?
No.
Distributions will I suppose use the device mapper, and individuals
will add a boot parameter. That is easiest.
It is bad enough that people will have to figure this out,
but there is no reason to make people's life more miserable.
Andries
Alan Cox wrote:
>>- Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
>> This is a known bug of rpm.
>> Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
>
>
> or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
> fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
>
Still fails with rpm 4.2.1 from rawhide without the LD_ASSUME_KERNEL
hack. I haven't checked rpm.org yet, that site appears to be dead.
--
Brian Gerst
First it has:
|>IO subsystem.
|>~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|>- Several different IO elevators are available to match different types
|> of workload. You can select which one to use with elvtune.
^^^^^^^
and then:
|>Deprecated.
|>~~~~~~~~~~~
|>- elvtune is deprecated (as are the ioctl's it used).
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> Instead, the io scheduler tunables are exported in sysfs (see below)
|> in the /sys/block/<device>/iosched directory.
|> Jens wrote a document explaining the tunables of the new scheduler at
|> http://www.lib.uaa.alaska.edu/linux-kernel/archive/2002-Week-44/att-deadline-iosched.txt
Also, it is /sys/block/<device>/queue/iosched/ on my box.
-JimC
Or just run gentoo... ;) (sorry Alan)
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 15:53, Brian Gerst wrote:
> Alan Cox wrote:
> >>- Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
> >> This is a known bug of rpm.
> >> Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
> >
> >
> > or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
> > fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
> >
>
> Still fails with rpm 4.2.1 from rawhide without the LD_ASSUME_KERNEL
> hack. I haven't checked rpm.org yet, that site appears to be dead.
On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 22:19, Shawn wrote:
> Or just run gentoo... ;) (sorry Alan)
The irony is that it seems to be because gentoo is too out of date to have
O_DIRECT enabled for the db4 library - which is where the problem is
being triggered 8)
On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 20:33, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> IIRC Alan's comment was "this fixes 99% of it"
I fixed the 2.4 one, but the 2.4 fix relies on old style scsi error
handling which has (thankfully on the whole) gone away in 2.5
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> USB:
> ~~~~
> - Very little user visible changes, the only noticable 'major' change
> is that there is now only one UHCI driver. As noted elsewhere, usbdevfs
> got renamed to usbfs.
The USB host controller drivers got renamed in 2.5. They are now:
uhci-hcd.o for UHCI USB host controllers
ohci-hcd.o for OHCI USB host controllers
ehci-hcd.o for EHCI (USB 2.0) host controllers
thanks,
greg k-h
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 10:33:50AM -0700, Robert Love wrote:
> On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 07:26, Alan Cox wrote:
>
> > or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
> > fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
>
> I think the 2.5 problem is _only_ in rpm 4.2.
>
> It looks like it is still in the latest version, too:
>
> [10:32:41]root@phantasy:~# rpm -q rpm
> rpm-4.2.1-0.11
> [10:32:44]root@phantasy:~# rpm --rebuilddb
> error: db4 error(16) from dbenv->remove: Device or resource busy
That's not the 2.5 problem. This one also happens with Red Hat's own
2.4 vendor kernels for Red Hat 9, and according to RPM's maintainer
it's a "harmless" message.
-Barry K. Nathan <[email protected]>
Barry K. Nathan wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 10:33:50AM -0700, Robert Love wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 07:26, Alan Cox wrote:
>>
>>
>>>or upgrade to rpm 4.2 (which I'd recommend everyone does anyway as it
>>>fixes a load of other problems) - ftp.rpm.org
>>
>>I think the 2.5 problem is _only_ in rpm 4.2.
>>
>>It looks like it is still in the latest version, too:
>>
>>[10:32:41]root@phantasy:~# rpm -q rpm
>>rpm-4.2.1-0.11
>>[10:32:44]root@phantasy:~# rpm --rebuilddb
>>error: db4 error(16) from dbenv->remove: Device or resource busy
>
>
> That's not the 2.5 problem. This one also happens with Red Hat's own
> 2.4 vendor kernels for Red Hat 9, and according to RPM's maintainer
> it's a "harmless" message.
Well, speaking with the rpm maintainer today, there are still issues
with O_DIRECT (db4) and NPTL.
Jeff
Previously Alan Cox wrote:
> On Gwe, 2003-07-11 at 15:02, Dave Jones wrote:
> > - Older Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) support (For XFree86 4.0)
> > has been removed. Upgrade to XFree86 4.1.0 or higher.
>
> The current 2.5 DRM doesnt seem to work with 4.1, but does with 4.3 at
> least on my testing of i810. I need to double check the results unless
> others see the same
If memory servers me correctly at least the XFree86 4.3.0 radeon driver
want a newer version of the kernel DRM modules than is present in
current 2.5. Unfortunately the code from the last DRI snapshot does not
seem to compile with 2.5.74 (haven't tried 2.5.75 yet).
Wichert.
--
Wichert Akkerman <[email protected]> It is simple to make things.
http://www.wiggy.net/ It is hard to make things simple.
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 01:51:53PM -0400, Brian Gerst wrote:
> There is no problem with the current version of this patch. I rewrote
> the original patch to work around the bug in gcc. The bug is that:
>
> if (size < X) return kmem_cache_alloc(...);
>
> would not cause the remaining if statements to be marked as dead code, but:
>
> if (size < X) goto found;
> ...
> found: return kmem_cache_alloc(...);
>
> does optimize properly.
Ok, I'll drop that part from the next version of the doc.
It's not a critical thing that most users will notice.
Dave
elvtune is mentioned here...
DJ> - Several different IO elevators are available to match different types
DJ> of workload. You can select which one to use with elvtune.
but deprecated here:
DJ> Deprecated.
DJ> ~~~~~~~~~~~
DJ> - usbdevfs will be going away in 2.7. The same filesystem can
DJ> be mounted as 'usbfs' in recent 2.4 kernels, and in 2.5.52
DJ> and above, which is what the filesystem will furthermore be
DJ> known as.
DJ> - elvtune is deprecated (as are the ioctl's it used).
DJ> Instead, the io scheduler tunables are exported in sysfs (see below)
DJ> in the /sys/block/<device>/iosched directory.
DJ> Jens wrote a document explaining the tunables of the new scheduler at
DJ> http://www.lib.uaa.alaska.edu/linux-kernel/archive/2002-Week-44/att-deadline-iosched.txt
Maybe just suggest the sysfs interface at once and not mention elvtune?
--
Meelis Roos ([email protected])
Dave Jones <[email protected]> writes:
[ ... ]
> CPU frequency scaling.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Certain processors have the facility to scale their
> voltage/clockspeed. 2.5 introduces an interface to this feature,
> see Documentation/cpufreq for more information. This functionality
> also covers features like Intel's speedstep, and the Powernow!
> feature present in mobile AMD Athlons. In addition to x86 variants,
> this framework also supports various ARM CPUs. You can find a
> userspace daemon that monitors battery life and adjusts accordingly
> at: http://www.staikos.net/~staikos/cpufreqd/
the cpufreqd project has been assimilated by a sourceforge project
with the same name, that can be found here:
<url: http://sourceforge.net/projects/cpufreqd/ >
[ ... ]
--
Terje
Dave Jones wrote:
> - Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
> This is a known bug of rpm.
> Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
Ah, _thank you_.
It's not an rpm bug, as such; it's a problem/bug with DB4, the
Berkeley DB library.
I just spent 2 hours trying to figure out why rpm was failing.
write() returning EINVAL for no reason? Finally spotted that O_DIRECT
was the significant bit.
I don't raise any eyebrows when rpm has a bug - after all, it's had
quite a few. But I was disappointed to find Berkeley DB's own db_dump
unable to read the rpm database too.
End result: I copied an rpm database from another machine. It's wrong
for this machine, but nearly right. Ah well.
If I'd only known about the LD_ASSUME_KERNEL fix sooner.
Can this go into Documentation/Changes, please?
-- Jamie
Andries Brouwer wrote:
> > Definitely. I'm hoping that people will decide upon a userland that
> > supports the popular (non-raid) partition tables as well as the simple
> > raid partitions, too.
>
> That reminds me.
>
> Our DOS-type partition tables are close to their limit -
> regularly people complain about things that do not work
> with disks of size between 1 TB and 2 TB, and if not today
> then very soon we'll see disks too large to handle with
> DOS-type partition tables.
>
> Two years ago or so I wrote some simple-minded stuff -
> maybe there also was discussion on Linux-type partition tables,
> I forgot all about it.
> (Maybe the format was plan9-inspired, with sequence number,
> start, size, label and uuid, all in ASCII.)
>
> What is the situation today? What is the structure of these
> LVM or raid partition tables? Is there some natural type
> suitable for crossing the 2 TB limit?
> Is it better to invent a Linux-type partition table?
What are the limits of the "Windows Logical Disk Manager (LDM)"
partition format? I've never used it myself, but it's there in
fs/partitions and presumably there are people using it on modern PCs.
-- Jamie
Jamie Lokier wrote:
> Dave Jones wrote:
>
>>- Some people seem to have trouble running rpm, most notably Red Hat 9 users.
>> This is a known bug of rpm.
>> Workaround: run "export LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5", before running rpm.
>
>
> Ah, _thank you_.
>
> It's not an rpm bug, as such; it's a problem/bug with DB4, the
> Berkeley DB library.
>
> I just spent 2 hours trying to figure out why rpm was failing.
> write() returning EINVAL for no reason? Finally spotted that O_DIRECT
> was the significant bit.
You got it. db4+O_DIRECT == blah. (I just had a conversation yesterday
with rpm's maintainer about what the problems are)
One problem is O_DIRECT should return an error on open(2) or fcntl(2),
not write(2).
Another problem appears to be that db does not know about the alignment
requirements of O_DIRECT.
> End result: I copied an rpm database from another machine. It's wrong
> for this machine, but nearly right. Ah well.
>
> If I'd only known about the LD_ASSUME_KERNEL fix sooner.
Unfortunately, LD_ASSUME_KERNEL is a lucky hack, not a fix. rpm dlopens
a pam .so. LD_ASSUME_KERNEL doesn't work for that .so, only for rpm
itself... fun ensues.
Jeff
On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Christoph Hellwig wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 12, 2003 at 01:43:15AM +1000, James Morris wrote:
> > On Fri, 11 Jul 2003, Dave Jones wrote:
> >
> > > Use the KAME tools port on
> > > ftp://ftp.inr.ac.ru/ip-routing/iputils-ss021109-try.tar.bz2
> >
> > The above is deprecated for ipsec, use the ipsec-tools stuff mentioned
> > below.
>
> Or the OpenBSD isakpmd or Herbert's patched freeswan userland, or..
Yes, but I meant specifically the ipsec tools (e.g. setkey) which were
initially in iptuils, can now be found updated and maintained in
ipsec-tools.
- James
--
James Morris
<[email protected]>
Jeff Garzik <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> One problem is O_DIRECT should return an error on open(2) or fcntl(2),
> not write(2).
That is the 2.5 behaviour.
Andrew Morton wrote:
> > One problem is O_DIRECT should return an error on open(2) or fcntl(2),
> > not write(2).
>
> That is the 2.5 behaviour.
What do you mean?
The problem with db4 is that operations on O_DIRECT handles now return
EINVAL if the address isn't suitable aligned, and db4 is not expecting
that - it aborts. That was true for 2.5.74, at least.
-- Jamie
Jamie Lokier wrote:
> Andrew Morton wrote:
>
>>>One problem is O_DIRECT should return an error on open(2) or fcntl(2),
>>> not write(2).
>>
>>That is the 2.5 behaviour.
>
>
> What do you mean?
>
> The problem with db4 is that operations on O_DIRECT handles now return
> EINVAL if the address isn't suitable aligned, and db4 is not expecting
> that - it aborts. That was true for 2.5.74, at least.
These are separate db4+kernel problems.
The first is that there needs to be a reliable way to know if O_DIRECT
writes are going to succeed or not. The 2.4 kernel fails on write(2)
but not open(2) or fcntl(2).
The second is that db4 doesn't appear to know about the alignment
requirement.
Jeff
Jeff Garzik wrote:
> These are separate db4+kernel problems.
>
> The first is that there needs to be a reliable way to know if O_DIRECT
> writes are going to succeed or not. The 2.4 kernel fails on write(2)
> but not open(2) or fcntl(2).
>
> The second is that db4 doesn't appear to know about the alignment
> requirement.
The alignment requirement can be probed if necessary - by reading a
misaligned page. It's ugly, but fixable in db4.
2.4 fails on write()? A strace of "rpm --rebuilddb" shows it is
opening with O_DIRECT and writing just fine. Or does that only work
with RedHat's 2.4 kernels?
-- Jamie
Jamie Lokier wrote:
> 2.4 fails on write()? A strace of "rpm --rebuilddb" shows it is
> opening with O_DIRECT and writing just fine. Or does that only work
> with RedHat's 2.4 kernels?
Are you testing on a filesystem where an O_DIRECT is not supported?
The "it works" case is not an issue.
Jeff
Jeff Garzik wrote:
> Jamie Lokier wrote:
> >2.4 fails on write()? A strace of "rpm --rebuilddb" shows it is
> >opening with O_DIRECT and writing just fine. Or does that only work
> >with RedHat's 2.4 kernels?
>
> Are you testing on a filesystem where an O_DIRECT is not supported?
> The "it works" case is not an issue.
ext3.
-- Jamie
On Sat, Jul 12, 2003 at 04:10:26PM +0300, Meelis Roos wrote:
> elvtune is mentioned here...
>
> DJ> - Several different IO elevators are available to match different types
> DJ> of workload. You can select which one to use with elvtune.
> but deprecated here:
>
> DJ> Deprecated.
> DJ> ~~~~~~~~~~~
> DJ> - usbdevfs will be going away in 2.7. The same filesystem can
> DJ> be mounted as 'usbfs' in recent 2.4 kernels, and in 2.5.52
> DJ> and above, which is what the filesystem will furthermore be
> DJ> known as.
> DJ> - elvtune is deprecated (as are the ioctl's it used).
> DJ> Instead, the io scheduler tunables are exported in sysfs (see below)
> DJ> in the /sys/block/<device>/iosched directory.
> DJ> Jens wrote a document explaining the tunables of the new scheduler at
> DJ> http://www.lib.uaa.alaska.edu/linux-kernel/archive/2002-Week-44/att-deadline-iosched.txt
Something seems amiss. The deprecated elvtune interface is the old -r/-w/-b command line.
I was lead to believe a new elvtune appeared which supports an option
for changing the elevator under 2.5, however a quick google doesn't turn
up any such patched elvtune, so I'm somewhat puzzled.
> Maybe just suggest the sysfs interface at once and not mention elvtune?
Changing the elevator type per device via sysfs does seem to make sense,
however /sys/block/<devicename>/queue/iosched/ doesn't yield anything
that would suggest this is possible (yet). I think Jens has patches for this?
Right now, afaics, the only way to change elevator is on a global (all
device) basis, booting with elevator=deadline or the like, so it looks
like the quote from post-halloween-2.5.txt has jumped the gun a little
and is discussing an as-yet unmerged feature. Jens ?
Dave
Dave Jones <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> ..
>
> Something seems amiss. The deprecated elvtune interface is the old -r/-w/-b command line.
> I was lead to believe a new elvtune appeared which supports an option
> for changing the elevator under 2.5, however a quick google doesn't turn
> up any such patched elvtune, so I'm somewhat puzzled.
No, we planned to do the selection via sysfs rather than ioctl.
> > Maybe just suggest the sysfs interface at once and not mention elvtune?
>
> Changing the elevator type per device via sysfs does seem to make sense,
> however /sys/block/<devicename>/queue/iosched/ doesn't yield anything
> that would suggest this is possible (yet). I think Jens has patches for this?
But it never happened. There are all sorts of nasties wrt actually making
the switch. Some related to request queueing, some to sysfs itself.
So yes, we should have runtime selection, and maybe sometime we will, but
the lowness of the return-to-effort ratio means it won't happen soon.
On Sat, Jul 12 2003, Andrew Morton wrote:
> Dave Jones <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > ..
> >
> > Something seems amiss. The deprecated elvtune interface is the old -r/-w/-b command line.
> > I was lead to believe a new elvtune appeared which supports an option
> > for changing the elevator under 2.5, however a quick google doesn't turn
> > up any such patched elvtune, so I'm somewhat puzzled.
>
> No, we planned to do the selection via sysfs rather than ioctl.
Right
> > > Maybe just suggest the sysfs interface at once and not mention
> > > elvtune?
> >
> > Changing the elevator type per device via sysfs does seem to make
> > sense, however /sys/block/<devicename>/queue/iosched/ doesn't yield
> > anything that would suggest this is possible (yet). I think Jens
> > has patches for this?
>
> But it never happened. There are all sorts of nasties wrt actually
Well the code exists.
> making the switch. Some related to request queueing, some to sysfs
> itself.
I don't recall any request queueing problems, it's pretty straight
forward to lock the queue down and prevent any new requests from
entering. sysfs problems is the only issue, and before Al does his magic
on that stuff, the patch just doesn't make sense. So it hasn't been
posted publically. With the sysfs disabled, I can switch io schedulers
on the fly quite easily.
> So yes, we should have runtime selection, and maybe sometime we will,
> but the lowness of the return-to-effort ratio means it won't happen
> soon.
Depends. If the sysfs stuff doesn't get fixed, then no it wont happen.
--
Jens Axboe
On Sun, Jul 13, 2003 at 08:51:18AM -0700, Andreas Dilger wrote:
> ext3 in 2.4 kernels does not support O_DIRECT. To confuse matters,
> recent RH kernels silently ignore O_DIRECT if you are not root, so
> you may think O_DIRECT is being used, but it isn't.
Modern RH kernels also ignore O_DIRECT if you are root: O_DIRECT is
completely disabled/ignored.
I suspect it is because gcc-3.2.2-5 (in RH9) does not compile 2.4
O_DIRECT correctly ..
greetings,
Rob van Nieuwkerk
Andreas Dilger wrote:
> On Jul 12, 2003 20:46 +0100, Jamie Lokier wrote:
>
>>Jeff Garzik wrote:
>>
>>>Jamie Lokier wrote:
>>>
>>>>2.4 fails on write()? A strace of "rpm --rebuilddb" shows it is
>>>>opening with O_DIRECT and writing just fine. Or does that only work
>>>>with RedHat's 2.4 kernels?
>>>
>>>Are you testing on a filesystem where an O_DIRECT is not supported?
>>>The "it works" case is not an issue.
>>
>>ext3.
>
>
> ext3 in 2.4 kernels does not support O_DIRECT. To confuse matters,
> recent RH kernels silently ignore O_DIRECT if you are not root, so
> you may think O_DIRECT is being used, but it isn't.
ahhh, that's probably what is going on. I was thinking only of stock
2.4 behavior (open succeeds, write fails).
Jeff
On Jul 12, 2003 20:46 +0100, Jamie Lokier wrote:
> Jeff Garzik wrote:
> > Jamie Lokier wrote:
> > >2.4 fails on write()? A strace of "rpm --rebuilddb" shows it is
> > >opening with O_DIRECT and writing just fine. Or does that only work
> > >with RedHat's 2.4 kernels?
> >
> > Are you testing on a filesystem where an O_DIRECT is not supported?
> > The "it works" case is not an issue.
>
> ext3.
ext3 in 2.4 kernels does not support O_DIRECT. To confuse matters,
recent RH kernels silently ignore O_DIRECT if you are not root, so
you may think O_DIRECT is being used, but it isn't.
Cheers, Andreas
--
Andreas Dilger
http://sourceforge.net/projects/ext2resize/
http://www-mddsp.enel.ucalgary.ca/People/adilger/
Hi!
> - software suspend is still in development, and in need of more work.
> It is unlikely to work as expected currently.
Actually it tends to work these days. No SMP, be carefull with
PREEMPT, and no unusual hardware, and it should work.
pavel
--
When do you have a heart between your knees?
[Johanka's followup: and *two* hearts?]
Hi Dave,
Can you add the following two points appended to the Generic VFS changes list?
Thanks
Maneesh
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:04:59PM +0000, Dave Jones wrote:
[...]
>
> Generic VFS changes.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - Since Linux 2.5.1 it is possible to atomically move a subtree to
> another place. The call is...
> mount --move olddir newdir
> - Since 2.5.43, dmask=value sets the umask applied to directories only.
> The default is the umask of the current process.
> The fmask=value sets the umask applied to regular files only.
> Again, the default is the umask of the current process.
- Since 2.5.62, dcache lookup is dcache_lock free. This does not affect
normal filesystems as long as they follow proper dcache interfaces. Care
should be taken (like holding per dentry lock) if one is racing with
d_lookup bringing a new dentry in dcache.
- Since 2.5.75-bk1 onwards separate lock is used for vfsmounts instead of
dcache_lock.
--
Maneesh Soni
IBM Linux Technology Center,
IBM India Software Lab, Bangalore.
Phone: +91-80-5044999 email: [email protected]
http://lse.sourceforge.net/
On Llu, 2003-07-14 at 01:03, Rob van Nieuwkerk wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 13, 2003 at 08:51:18AM -0700, Andreas Dilger wrote:
> > ext3 in 2.4 kernels does not support O_DIRECT. To confuse matters,
> > recent RH kernels silently ignore O_DIRECT if you are not root, so
> > you may think O_DIRECT is being used, but it isn't.
>
> Modern RH kernels also ignore O_DIRECT if you are root: O_DIRECT is
> completely disabled/ignored.
>
> I suspect it is because gcc-3.2.2-5 (in RH9) does not compile 2.4
> O_DIRECT correctly ..
Wrong guess.
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
> In preparation for the flood of testers as we approach 2.6pre,
> I thought I'd give this doc another airing to be sure that it
> isn't missing anything important.. (Plus I've been meaning to
> post an update for a while, and 42 sounded like a good number).
>
> Dave
Dave,
thanks a lot for the effort of writing this document. I think it's very
nice.
I think that a very useful thing for have a quite large group of people
testing 2.6pre is a similar document that explain "what should I do with
my distribution to test 2.6pre?". For example, I have an uptodate
mandrake 9.1: it would be very nice to have a page where I can
download package/learn what to do to test a 2.6kernel. Anyone knows if
there is such a page over there? Otherwise, it would be nice that the
distribution's gurus could advice us...
Thanks again to all linux-kernel people,
Romano
--
Romano Giannetti - Univ. Pontificia Comillas (Madrid, Spain)
Electronic Engineer - phone +34 915 422 800 ext 2416 fax +34 915 596 569
On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 04:02:21PM +0100, Paul Nasrat wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 03:02:19PM +0100, Dave Jones wrote:
>
> > Known gotchas.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Certain known bugs are being reported over and over. Here are the
> > workarounds.
> > - Blank screen after decompressing kernel?
> > Make sure your .config has
> > CONFIG_INPUT=y, CONFIG_VT=y, CONFIG_VGA_CONSOLE=y and CONFIG_VT_CONSOLE=y
> > A lot of people have discovered that taking their .config from 2.4 and
> > running make oldconfig to pick up new options leads to problems, notably
> > with CONFIG_VT not being set.
>
> You might want to mention the synaptics touchpad driver/event for
> XFree86, as I'm sure that will be a FAQ amongst laptop users
>
> http://w1.894.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/
Yes, please, this is very much needed.
--
Vojtech Pavlik
SuSE Labs, SuSE CR
On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 12:21:16PM +0530, Maneesh Soni wrote:
> Can you add the following two points appended to the Generic VFS changes list?
>
> Thanks
> Maneesh
I had considered putting such things in there a while ago, but wanted
the doc to just let _users_ know what changes they should be aware of.
This sort of thing really belongs in a 2.5-api-changes.txt or the likes.
(Which I did ponder doing at one point, but time got the better of me).
Dave
> On Fri, Jul 11, 2003 at 02:04:59PM +0000, Dave Jones wrote:
> [...]
> >
> > Generic VFS changes.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > - Since Linux 2.5.1 it is possible to atomically move a subtree to
> > another place. The call is...
> > mount --move olddir newdir
> > - Since 2.5.43, dmask=value sets the umask applied to directories only.
> > The default is the umask of the current process.
> > The fmask=value sets the umask applied to regular files only.
> > Again, the default is the umask of the current process.
> - Since 2.5.62, dcache lookup is dcache_lock free. This does not affect
> normal filesystems as long as they follow proper dcache interfaces. Care
> should be taken (like holding per dentry lock) if one is racing with
> d_lookup bringing a new dentry in dcache.
> - Since 2.5.75-bk1 onwards separate lock is used for vfsmounts instead of
> dcache_lock.
>
>
> --
> Maneesh Soni
> IBM Linux Technology Center,
> IBM India Software Lab, Bangalore.
> Phone: +91-80-5044999 email: [email protected]
> http://lse.sourceforge.net/
---end quoted text---
On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 10:30:58AM +0200, Romano Giannetti wrote:
> thanks a lot for the effort of writing this document. I think it's very
> nice.
>
> I think that a very useful thing for have a quite large group of people
> testing 2.6pre is a similar document that explain "what should I do with
> my distribution to test 2.6pre?". For example, I have an uptodate
> mandrake 9.1: it would be very nice to have a page where I can
> download package/learn what to do to test a 2.6kernel. Anyone knows if
> there is such a page over there? Otherwise, it would be nice that the
> distribution's gurus could advice us...
I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
knowledge to add these for every distro out there. And these days quite
a few distros are starting to ship module-init-tools and the likes, so
the situation shouldn't be too bad.
Dave
On Mon, 14 Jul 2003, Dave Jones wrote:
> I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
> texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
> knowledge to add these for every distro out there.
If you wish to include Ark Linux:
=== CUT ===
Ark Linux users can simply use
"apt-get update; apt-get install kernel26"
to get 2.6.0-test1 and everything it depends on.
=== CUT ===
LLaP
bero
--
Ark Linux - Linux for the masses
http://www.arklinux.org/
Redistribution and processing of this message is subject to
http://www.arklinux.org/terms.php
On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:41, Dave Jones wrote:
> I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
> texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
> knowledge to add these for every distro out there.
RHL9 rpms are at
http://people.redhat.com/arjanv/2.5/
On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 02:13:05PM +0200, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:41, Dave Jones wrote:
>
> > I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
> > texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
> > knowledge to add these for every distro out there.
>
> RHL9 rpms are at
>
> http://people.redhat.com/arjanv/2.5/
Won't people need rawhide modutils for these? ( plus optional ipsec
utils, etc which are there)
Paul
On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:13, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:41, Dave Jones wrote:
>
> > I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
> > texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
> > knowledge to add these for every distro out there.
>
> RHL9 rpms are at
>
> http://people.redhat.com/arjanv/2.5/
Hi,
I wouldn't personally say these 2.5 kernel RPM's you are building are
for RHL 9 systems, well not stock systems at any rate. Unless of course
you are advocating --nodeps installing them?
Regards
Philip Wyett
--
AOL Instant Messenger (AIM) or Yahoo Messenger: PhilipWyett
Email: [email protected]
Website: http://www.philipwyett.dsl.pipex.com
Public key: http://www.philipwyett.dsl.pipex.com/gpg/public_key.txt
--
On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 14:37, Philip Wyett wrote:
> On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:13, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> > On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:41, Dave Jones wrote:
> >
> > > I've no objection to taking "heres links to packages for xxx distro"
> > > texts if people want to write them, but I don't have the time, nor
> > > knowledge to add these for every distro out there.
> >
> > RHL9 rpms are at
> >
> > http://people.redhat.com/arjanv/2.5/
>
> Hi,
>
> I wouldn't personally say these 2.5 kernel RPM's you are building are
> for RHL 9 systems, well not stock systems at any rate. Unless of course
> you are advocating --nodeps installing them?
the plan is to put the requires helper packages up as well but the
buildsystem isn't currently on friendly terms with me ;(
to be there asap.
On Fri, 2003-07-11 at 17:38, Barry K. Nathan wrote:
> That's not the 2.5 problem. This one also happens with Red Hat's own
> 2.4 vendor kernels for Red Hat 9, and according to RPM's maintainer
> it's a "harmless" message.
As Jeff said, the other Jeff says there are still problems.
And setting LD_ASSUME_KERNEL=2.2.5 before running rpm prevents the
errors. So I am not so sure..
Robert Love
On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 04:05:58PM +0200, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 14:37, Philip Wyett wrote:
> > On Mon, 2003-07-14 at 13:13, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> > > RHL9 rpms are at
> the plan is to put the requires helper packages up as well but the
> buildsystem isn't currently on friendly terms with me ;(
> to be there asap.
Hmm, any chance of putting the spec/patches and .configs split out to
minimise downloads for those of us who already have the kernel archive?
Things I note that aren't there yet (or in rawhide from what I can see),
an lvm2 package - but I imagine that'll come in time. The ipsec-tools
are in rawhide, but what you provide should be good for getting people
up and running.
I like the combined modutils patch, that seems more user friendly.
Cheers
Paul
On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't have
> a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
People are encountering that limit already. We need something
better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
Andries
On Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 07:08:04PM +0200, Andries Brouwer wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
>
> > So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't have
> > a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
>
> Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
> 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
>
> People are encountering that limit already. We need something
> better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
Please point me to an URL for a 2TB hard drive. Or are you pointing out
that hardware raid setups look like a single drive (block device)?
On Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 12:42:15PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> > DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
> > 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
> >
> > People are encountering that limit already. We need something
> > better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
>
> Please point me to an URL for a 2TB hard drive. Or are you pointing out
> that hardware raid setups look like a single drive (block device)?
Yes.
On Tuesday 15 July 2003 12:08, Andries Brouwer wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> > So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't have
> > a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
>
> Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
> 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
>
> People are encountering that limit already. We need something
> better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
>
> Andries
I would suggest the GPT format. It was originally designed for use with the
IA-64 EFI firmware, but works just fine on any other architecture. It's
64-bit, so no 2 TB limitations. It also avoids the primary vs. extended vs.
logical partition weirdness that DOS has.
--
Kevin Corry
[email protected]
http://evms.sourceforge.net/
>>>>> "Andries" == Andries Brouwer <[email protected]> writes:
Andries> On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
>> So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't
>> have a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
Andries> Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
Andries> 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
Andries> People are encountering that limit already. We need something
Andries> better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
We had this discussion before, back when I first submitted the large
block device patches. The consensus then was to use EFI, or LDM.
Unless the BIOS supports a partitioning scheme, you're not
going to be able to boot anyway, or at least not without doing
something clever.
--
Dr Peter Chubb http://www.gelato.unsw.edu.au peterc AT gelato.unsw.edu.au
You are lost in a maze of BitKeeper repositories, all slightly different.
On Wed, Jul 16, 2003 at 02:16:11PM +1000, Peter Chubb wrote:
> >>>>> "Andries" == Andries Brouwer <[email protected]> writes:
>
> Andries> On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> >> So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't
> >> have a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
>
> Andries> Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
> Andries> 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
>
> Andries> People are encountering that limit already. We need something
> Andries> better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
>
> We had this discussion before, back when I first submitted the large
> block device patches. The consensus then was to use EFI, or LDM.
>
> Unless the BIOS supports a partitioning scheme, you're not
> going to be able to boot anyway, or at least not without doing
> something clever.
The bios shouldn't even know about partition tables. It just loads the code
in the MBR, and the boot loader deals with the rest from there.
How else would BSD be able to work with their non-DOS slices anyway?
On Wed, Jul 16, 2003 at 10:07:20AM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 16, 2003 at 02:16:11PM +1000, Peter Chubb wrote:
> > >>>>> "Andries" == Andries Brouwer <[email protected]> writes:
> >
> > Andries> On Mon, Jul 14, 2003 at 05:03:31PM -0700, Mike Fedyk wrote:
> > >> So, will the DOS partition make it up to 2TB? If so, then we won't
> > >> have a problem until we have larger than 2TB drives
> >
> > Andries> Yes, DOS partition table works up to 2^32 sectors, and with
> > Andries> 2^9-byte sectors that is 2 TiB.
> >
> > Andries> People are encountering that limit already. We need something
> > Andries> better, either use some existing scheme, or invent something.
> >
> > We had this discussion before, back when I first submitted the large
> > block device patches. The consensus then was to use EFI, or LDM.
> >
> > Unless the BIOS supports a partitioning scheme, you're not
> > going to be able to boot anyway, or at least not without doing
> > something clever.
>
> The bios shouldn't even know about partition tables. It just loads the code
> in the MBR, and the boot loader deals with the rest from there.
There are some bios variants that refuse to boot if the hard disk has no
partition with the boot-flag set.
LLAP, Martin
> We had this discussion before, back when I first submitted the large
> block device patches. The consensus then was to use EFI, or LDM.
GNU parted has had the GPT code for a couple years now, and
CONFIG_EFI_PARTITION has been in both 2.4.x and 2.5.x trees for over a
year. To the best of my knowledge and experience, it works equally well
on x86 as on IA-64, modulo booting with traditional BIOSs of course.
# parted /dev/sdb print
# parted /dev/sdb mklabel gpt
# parted /dev/sdb mkpartfs p ext2 0.017 some-really-big-number
partx in util-linux can even tell the kernel about it without requiring
a reboot.
I'd definitely be interested to know of cases where it doesn't work, so
I can get them addressed.
Thanks,
Matt
--
Matt Domsch
Sr. Software Engineer, Lead Engineer
Dell Linux Solutions http://www.dell.com/linux
Linux on Dell mailing lists @ http://lists.us.dell.com
[email protected] wrote:
> GNU parted has had the GPT code for a couple years now, and
> CONFIG_EFI_PARTITION has been in both 2.4.x and 2.5.x trees for over a
> year. To the best of my knowledge and experience, it works equally well
> on x86 as on IA-64, modulo booting with traditional BIOSs of course.
>
When I rebuilt my server a few months back, I wanted to use GPT
partitioning so I could have UUIDs on the partitions, etc. The
stumbling block that I ran into is there are no boot loaders that
support GPT partitioning (LILO and GRUB being the obvious ones). Even
though my BIOS doesn't care and would load the MBR, that MBR has to
accomplish something useful.
Since GPT partitioning is normally only used in IA-64 land, and all
IA-64 systems come with EFI stuff that handles the tasks that
LILO/GRUB would handle on an x86 system, I guess there hasn't been
much demand for GPT support for non-EFI systems. So the BIOS is not
really the issue, since "traditional BIOSs" (as Matt referred to them)
don't handle bootloading tasks at all except at the most basic level.
Another one:
rmmod on net drivers no longer produces the behavior that's existed
since modules were first added to the kernel.
Jeff
On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 04:54:39PM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> Another one:
>
> rmmod on net drivers no longer produces the behavior that's existed
> since modules were first added to the kernel.
And that new behaviour is?
Mike Fedyk wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 04:54:39PM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote:
>
>>Another one:
>>
>>rmmod on net drivers no longer produces the behavior that's existed
>>since modules were first added to the kernel.
>
>
> And that new behaviour is?
No reference counts reported to module subsystem at all, so, you can
rmmod a module at any time, even if the interface is up and running.
Even though net devices are independently refcounted and internally
consistent, I have no idea if the module's code is refcounted elsewhere
or not. So, I hope it's safe...
Jeff
On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 05:23:49PM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote:
> Even though net devices are independently refcounted and internally
> consistent, I have no idea if the module's code is refcounted elsewhere
> or not. So, I hope it's safe...
With the rmmod -a cronjobs some people like to run it'll break horribly :)
Christoph Hellwig <[email protected]> writes:
> > Even though net devices are independently refcounted and internally
> > consistent, I have no idea if the module's code is refcounted elsewhere
> > or not. So, I hope it's safe...
>
> With the rmmod -a cronjobs some people like to run it'll break horribly :)
Yes. I think rmmod -a (and modprobe -r) should go away then - unless the
correct behavior is back.
--
Krzysztof Halasa
Network Administrator